Why Women Choose the Bear: Bro Code and Rape Academy

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Hello, Hello, my name is.
Claire and I'm Mel, and together

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we.
Are.

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The salty hoes.
Coming at you again from the

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Mordor corridor with a with a
interesting topic today.

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Maybe a more hard hitting, less
humorous than we normally do.

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I feel like we're still going to
make jokes, probably.

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However, yes, there might be a
little more element of

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seriousness to this because I
think it's fair to say that we

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are both fucking pissed.
Yes, we're like mad, Yeah.

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And we I know we signed a little
subdued, but it's it's that

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churning, burning low level just
enough is fucking enough kind of

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burn.
Yeah, it's yeah, it's gross.

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So you may have realized at this
point that we're going to talk

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about men and not making any
apologies for that intro.

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Nope.
And we're going to speak

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specifically about the rape
Academy.

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Yep, that was just this
wonderful news story.

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What week?
Week and 1/2.

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Ago.
Yeah, a couple of weeks ago,

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maybe.
That just broke.

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Of course, this is something
that's been going on for quite

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some time.
Yeah, what it's not like new,

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but I think like the volume as
in the amount of men making

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visits to the rape Academy site
and also the name like of having

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an actual Academy as in learning
to do really terrible things was

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was just so.
Gross.

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Yeah, it was shocking.
It was stomach turning.

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We're upset.
We're mad.

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We are and so we want to talk
about it today because we would

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imagine that some of you want to
talk about it too, or at least

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know that you're not alone or
maybe you're tired having to say

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oh, but not all men because at
this.

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Point Well, it might not be all
men, but I think we're going to

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talk about grow code a little
bit and how the actions of many

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men, even if they're men that
would never directly physically

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harm a woman, how these actions
actually support and enable some

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of these things to happen.
And I think that's important to

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talk about in any circumstance,
right?

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Because we know that silence is
complicit complicity or means

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you're complicit.
That's one of those words in

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many circumstances, right?
You could apply that to many

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things, and I think the the bro
code here is a thing in that

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regard.
And also, if you're being silent

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at this point, man, then you
are.

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Complicit.
Yeah.

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And if you're unaware, well,
then this would be a great first

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action to take.
Listen to this whole podcast.

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Yeah.
Maybe do a little self

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reflection.
Yep, whatever, send it to the

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salty Bros in your life.
And also, if you haven't heard

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about this, by an eye, are you
the Rhode Island Ostrich?

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Like, is your head buried in the
motherfucking?

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Grind.
Is that a fucking ostrich?

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It's not a fucking ostrich.
Well, clearly the men that say

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they haven't heard about it yet
are those fucking ostriches.

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Yeah, yeah.
Yeah.

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So in that case, they're not off
the hook.

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No, no.
So we're just, we're just going

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to call it what it is today.
We are sorry, not sorry.

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So buckle up, bitches.
Yep.

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Here we go.
Here we go.

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And, you know, little trigger
warning, obviously, we've

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already alluded to it discussing
sexual violence, sexual assault.

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We know that can be triggering
for some people.

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So, you know, do what you need
to do if this is an episode to

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skip because it feels like too
much, Totally get that.

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And just know ahead of time
we're going to be mentioning

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those things.
Yeah, that's right.

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Specifically, that disclaimer is
for our listeners who have been

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on the receiving end of sexual
violence, sexual assault,

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etcetera.
You're not off the hook because

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you're a man that doesn't want
to listen to us, Bashman.

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Sorry.
I love that clarification.

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Yes, if this makes you feel
uncomfortable or you feel

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defensive then put on noise
cancelling headphones with our

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voices in it.
Please sit down and make

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yourself comfy and listen.
Please.

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Yes, Yeah.
All right.

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Well, so maybe I would like to
actually start with the title

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that I think we're we're going
to use, which goes back to how

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long ago was it a year or two
ago when it was like the man

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versus bear controversy?
Yes, like if you're out hiking

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alone, which by the way I do all
the time.

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Yeah, really on a near daily
basis, yeah.

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And I have my dog, but not
always.

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Would you rather run into a man
or a bear?

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And this turned into one of
those Internet kerfuffles.

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Maybe is the word kerfuffle.
I love that word.

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It's really fun.
A wee kerfuffle, Yes, a

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kerfuffle where so many women
were saying, well, I would

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choose the bear and so many men
felt like they were being

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personally attacked.
Like the amount of men that were

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so butt hurt by this, you know,
kerfuffle.

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I mean, and and the responses I
think ranged from lighthearted

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and funny to quite serious.
Yes, it was all over the board.

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Yep.
And I think from what I

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remember, the original
statistics for 9 out of 10 women

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said.
They'd pick the bear.

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Yeah.
It was quite a lot, yeah.

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It was high and then when from
that initial study, then it was

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supported by all the women that
were like, haven't thought about

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it like that before.
But yes, because the bear is

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more predictable.
I also have techniques, you

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know, depending on what kind of
bear it is, to lay down and play

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dead, to make myself big.
And they'll probably work,

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right, you know?
Have have you ever encountered a

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bear in the wild, Claire?
I have not encountered a bear.

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I have definitely been on hikes
where people have said there is

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a bear here.
So I've been on bear alert.

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But oh, actually I'm lying.
I was at Yosemite and I did see

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a little family of bears.
Actually it's.

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Very cute.
So cute I didn't feel afraid.

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Yeah.
There was other people and I

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mean, they're very tame there, I
think because they see a lot of.

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People, they're very habituated
to people.

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What they're really after in
Yosemite is your coolers, yes.

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Not, not your your foot.
Yeah.

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Have you seen them hiking?
I have seen bears many times

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actually, in the wild.
I have not seen them here in

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Utah, to be clear, But I have
seen them many times up in

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Wyoming.
I've seen them in Yosemite as

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well.
And I have seen them in Alaska.

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Yeah.
And I, you know, a bear is

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something when you see it in the
wild, you want to have a healthy

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respect for my experience with
being very close to them

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actually in Alaska.
And these would be brown bears,

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so quite dangerous.
Yes, potentially.

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Is that to make yourself big
response bear?

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There's a cute little rhyme.
Do you know?

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Do you know what it is?
I do not.

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Oh.
OK, so we have, we have various

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species of bears, right?
So in North America we have

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black bears.
Yeah, we have brown bears, which

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are also sometimes called
grizzly bears.

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Yes.
And we have polar bears.

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OK, so the rhyme goes if it's
brown, lay down.

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If it's black, fight back.
If it's white, goodnight.

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Oh yes, I do know that about
polar bears in Alaska.

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I've watched like some
documentaries where they roam

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around people's times and it's
just like, yes, very.

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Bad.
You definitely don't want to

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meet a polar bear in the wild.
In that case, I would probably

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pick the man because a polar
bear is predictable in the sense

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that it will eat you it.
Will eat you all up.

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Yeah, it's a generalist predator
and it will pretty much eat

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anything it can get its paws on.
And they're also massive killing

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machines, so not something you
want to encounter alone in the

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wild.
Now, a brown bear.

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My experience with brown bears
is has never been terrifying in

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Alaska.
I've done a couple of bear

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viewing type things, most
recently last summer in Catmi

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National Park where the bears
are all feeding on the salmon.

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So if you've ever seen those
pictures or videos where they're

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fishing for salmon, I think we
saw over 75 bears that day, in

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one day.
Yeah, it was wild.

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Some of them from the air, like
the light plane, some of them

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from the ground, 'cause we were
just hiking around.

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Yeah, in some cases, we were
within 20 feet of bears.

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The bear had no interest in us
as humans whatsoever.

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They were eating salmon.
So their job was just to eat

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salmon and get fat for the
winter.

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Sounds like a good life
honestly.

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Well, you know, until the winter
comes, the Alaskan winter seems

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like no joke.
That would be long.

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Yeah.
Yeah, but I did not really feel

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unsafe at any time.
I mean, it's definitely it, you

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know, You're like, oh, shit,
like this is real.

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But none of them made any sort
of aggressive moves or any

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indication that they would be a
problem.

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Well, and I think it's worth
noting to that, you know, for

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maybe our listeners right side
you talk cuz I have to say as a

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wee foreigner coming here that
it was a shock to me the amount

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of wildlife that actually is
here back home.

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It was like cats, dogs on foxes,
you know, that was about it.

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And here, you know, there are
mountain lions and there have

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been videos of people on a hike
and seeing mountain lions.

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And you know, I when I hike, I
do carry pepper spray, but

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mostly for men.
Honestly, yeah.

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Really though.
Yeah, but you know, I always

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think, Oh well, if I see an
animal, I have it just in case.

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But I I have always LED with the
fear of men because I hike alone

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too.
I like to trail run alone as

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well.
And you know, that's that's

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usually why I'm packing the
pepper spray.

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Yeah, for sure.
I'd be more afraid to meet a

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Puma in the wild or a Mountain
Lion or a cougar or whatever you

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want to call it.
Then I would be a bear because,

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you know, mountain lions do
occasionally attack people with

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the intent of eating them.
It's quite rare, but it's it

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does happen.
And they're fast and scrappy,

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too.
Yeah.

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And often times, I mean, I
wonder, I've never seen one here

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in Utah.
I had to go all the way down to

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Patagonia to see Puma in the
wild.

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But.
But they're there.

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And you're like, I wonder how
they have seen me.

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Yeah.
Yeah.

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So back in 2022, there was a
lion attack in Mill Creek on the

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pipeline trail.
And I was actually there two

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hours after the attack.
The woman escaped with minor

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injuries.
They think the the Mountain Lion

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was actually startled, like she
wasn't stalking them but was on

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the trail and they came across
around.

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And anyway, there was, you know,
they later destroyed the cat,

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which is sad, but you
understand, right?

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You can't have that happening on
the trail.

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So that would be more
frightening than a bear.

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That being said, a bear is
nothing to mess with.

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You know you do want to take
that seriously.

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Yeah, I wouldn't be.
I wouldn't be messing with the

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bear, but.
But statistics say we should be

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much more frightened of the men.
Yes.

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And that's, you know, as I say,
that's my main motivation.

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And, and the pepper spray while
going on a hike is men is, you

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know, or if you're walking to
your car at night or, you know,

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it's definitely something I
bought for my daughters at quite

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an early age.
And I think about that often in

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terms of I have a son and I have
two daughters, and I believe

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that I have raised my son to not
be a jerk.

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And can confirm, your son is
lovely.

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Well, thank you.
I, you know, we, we both have

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sons and I, I, I wouldn't
believe in that they, you know,

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have had.
Well, here's the thing.

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I, sorry, I'm not being clear
here.

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I mean, our sons are also not
immune to society, right?

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Yeah, that's right.
And schools and, you know, some

227
00:12:23,040 --> 00:12:25,240
of of the ideas that get put
into their heads.

228
00:12:25,240 --> 00:12:27,680
But I just think about the
difference.

229
00:12:28,160 --> 00:12:31,840
This is what I'm getting at in
terms of from a very young age I

230
00:12:31,840 --> 00:12:33,880
was teaching my daughters to
protect themselves.

231
00:12:34,400 --> 00:12:37,920
Right.
As is sad to say, but it's an

232
00:12:37,920 --> 00:12:40,760
essential thing that they
actually have to learn.

233
00:12:40,760 --> 00:12:43,560
I mean, yes, should we live in a
world where they don't have to

234
00:12:43,560 --> 00:12:45,360
worry about that?
Absolutely.

235
00:12:45,840 --> 00:12:49,840
But until we're teaching all the
men, you know, not to rape, then

236
00:12:49,840 --> 00:12:52,080
we do have to teach our young
women how to protect themselves

237
00:12:52,080 --> 00:12:57,000
from that.
A. 100% and you know things like

238
00:12:57,000 --> 00:13:01,920
pepper spray and Shanks and you
know, I have even had a teaser

239
00:13:01,920 --> 00:13:02,880
at 1:00.
Point just.

240
00:13:04,680 --> 00:13:08,600
You know, because it's, it's
something that you have to

241
00:13:08,600 --> 00:13:12,400
consider that I think maybe a
lot of men, that's their

242
00:13:12,400 --> 00:13:14,520
privilege, right?
They can just go walk at night

243
00:13:14,520 --> 00:13:16,120
and not think anything of it,
No.

244
00:13:16,720 --> 00:13:19,400
Just carefree, Yes.
Were you taught as a child?

245
00:13:19,400 --> 00:13:23,360
Because I was, or at least as a
teenager, to arrange your keys

246
00:13:23,360 --> 00:13:24,800
in your hand.
So they're kind of like the

247
00:13:24,800 --> 00:13:27,800
brass knuckles, Right?
So like 1 pointing out between

248
00:13:27,800 --> 00:13:30,320
each finger so that you could
punch with like, a fistful of

249
00:13:30,320 --> 00:13:31,120
keys.
Yeah.

250
00:13:31,280 --> 00:13:32,680
I mean, from a teen.
Yeah.

251
00:13:32,800 --> 00:13:36,080
You are taught ways to protect
yourself.

252
00:13:36,160 --> 00:13:38,520
Yep.
And, you know, I think it's

253
00:13:38,840 --> 00:13:43,640
worth noting that I grew up in
an area of conflict.

254
00:13:43,680 --> 00:13:46,000
Yes.
And I was still more scared of

255
00:13:46,000 --> 00:13:48,200
men.
As as you should have been.

256
00:13:48,200 --> 00:13:53,800
Bombs or shootings, which were
done mostly by men at the right.

257
00:13:54,360 --> 00:13:56,400
But but again, like the stats
would say, that's a more

258
00:13:56,400 --> 00:13:58,880
rational fear.
Yeah, and I and I was like

259
00:13:58,880 --> 00:14:02,280
walking home late at night or,
you know, when there was things

260
00:14:02,280 --> 00:14:05,720
happening often and that was
more of my fear.

261
00:14:05,920 --> 00:14:08,400
Yeah, completely reasonable,
yeah.

262
00:14:09,120 --> 00:14:12,000
Welcome with your like you say,
your key, your keys sticking

263
00:14:12,040 --> 00:14:12,960
out.
So yeah.

264
00:14:12,960 --> 00:14:15,480
Of course, I don't really have a
lot of physical keys anymore,

265
00:14:15,480 --> 00:14:18,720
so.
What are these car

266
00:14:18,720 --> 00:14:20,880
manufacturers?
Trying to do now they've.

267
00:14:20,880 --> 00:14:25,000
Given us a plastic fob to keep
in our pocket, we we have to get

268
00:14:25,000 --> 00:14:26,880
more creative with our with our
weapons.

269
00:14:26,920 --> 00:14:28,920
Maybe buy some brass knuckles, I
don't know.

270
00:14:29,000 --> 00:14:30,320
Yeah.
Numb Chucks.

271
00:14:30,520 --> 00:14:33,880
Yeah, something.
Oh my God, yeah, it's crazy.

272
00:14:33,880 --> 00:14:36,760
And I, I would imagine that
there would be people that would

273
00:14:36,880 --> 00:14:40,760
classify us as violent or why do
you need all that or.

274
00:14:41,080 --> 00:14:44,240
Well, I mean, first of all,
self-defense isn't violence.

275
00:14:44,800 --> 00:14:48,040
I, you know, have never had to
use my fistful of keys before,

276
00:14:48,040 --> 00:14:50,480
but it was certainly something
that was explained.

277
00:14:51,200 --> 00:14:55,560
Also growing up, I remember at
least two times and one of them

278
00:14:55,560 --> 00:14:57,960
I actually think was through
church.

279
00:14:57,960 --> 00:15:00,320
So kudos to the ward for this, I
suppose.

280
00:15:00,640 --> 00:15:03,560
Having a cop come and teaching
us self-defense techniques.

281
00:15:04,000 --> 00:15:08,720
Like, if you are assaulted by a
stranger, how do you, you know,

282
00:15:08,720 --> 00:15:12,040
get out of that, right?
Given that most women cannot win

283
00:15:12,040 --> 00:15:13,680
a fight physically against a
man.

284
00:15:13,680 --> 00:15:15,640
So the point is, how do you hurt
them?

285
00:15:16,080 --> 00:15:18,160
You know enough, fast enough
that you can run away,

286
00:15:18,160 --> 00:15:19,880
essentially.
That's really what it is.

287
00:15:20,040 --> 00:15:23,160
Yeah, well, kudos to the ward.
It was very.

288
00:15:23,160 --> 00:15:24,760
Progressive.
I know, right?

289
00:15:26,280 --> 00:15:27,680
Wow.
So.

290
00:15:27,760 --> 00:15:30,120
California.
War, I mean, I think, I think

291
00:15:30,120 --> 00:15:31,880
that's right.
So credit where it's due.

292
00:15:32,160 --> 00:15:35,760
Yeah, absolutely.
And I think it's worth noting,

293
00:15:35,760 --> 00:15:41,280
too, that I think by the time I
was maybe 17 years old, I had

294
00:15:41,280 --> 00:15:43,720
been groped twice in the street.
Oh yeah.

295
00:15:44,040 --> 00:15:48,000
By by that young age, the first
time, I didn't even really

296
00:15:48,000 --> 00:15:50,440
realize what was happening at
the time.

297
00:15:50,440 --> 00:15:53,560
And it wasn't until sort of
after I was like, wait, what?

298
00:15:53,720 --> 00:15:58,200
Like just happened there?
And yeah, like, what do you do

299
00:15:58,200 --> 00:16:02,080
about that?
Yeah, it's kind of horrifying.

300
00:16:02,080 --> 00:16:05,840
Yeah, same.
I was definitely groped and

301
00:16:05,840 --> 00:16:08,320
sexually assaulted, But while I
was a child, OK.

302
00:16:08,560 --> 00:16:13,520
Yeah, even I remember pretty
early, like in middle school, we

303
00:16:13,520 --> 00:16:17,360
had an exhibitionist that used
to come to the track early in

304
00:16:17,360 --> 00:16:20,520
the morning and expose his erect
penis to the girls running

305
00:16:20,520 --> 00:16:21,200
around the track.
Oh.

306
00:16:21,680 --> 00:16:23,080
My God.
Yeah.

307
00:16:23,200 --> 00:16:24,680
And it was just known by this.
It was.

308
00:16:24,760 --> 00:16:26,440
Just known.
It was just known.

309
00:16:26,600 --> 00:16:28,120
Just a thing.
He did just a thing.

310
00:16:28,120 --> 00:16:31,320
He was on the other side of the
fence and, like, in the bushes,

311
00:16:31,320 --> 00:16:34,320
right?
Just like exposing himself to

312
00:16:34,320 --> 00:16:36,640
the the teens and preteens,
right?

313
00:16:36,640 --> 00:16:38,480
Because this is middle school.
Wild.

314
00:16:38,600 --> 00:16:41,680
Yeah.
That because I have similar

315
00:16:41,680 --> 00:16:44,360
experiences where you know of
people in the neighborhood or

316
00:16:44,360 --> 00:16:46,280
things that happen and you're
just like, what?

317
00:16:46,320 --> 00:16:48,520
Why didn't nobody do anything
about that?

318
00:16:48,560 --> 00:16:52,400
Like surely it didn't, you know,
it didn't happen in isolation.

319
00:16:52,400 --> 00:16:54,720
It was repeated.
You just expected to see him in

320
00:16:54,720 --> 00:16:57,000
the morning like.
Yes, wild, right?

321
00:16:57,000 --> 00:16:59,560
It's like, oh, I wonder if we're
going to see like that guy.

322
00:17:00,600 --> 00:17:03,840
Oh my God.
Yeah, disgusting.

323
00:17:04,000 --> 00:17:06,839
That's insane.
Or, you know, highly sexualized

324
00:17:06,839 --> 00:17:11,880
comments from the, you know, as
early as 11 or 12 from adult

325
00:17:11,880 --> 00:17:14,760
men, adult men in the ward,
adult men at school.

326
00:17:15,440 --> 00:17:17,839
Well, I mean, we've talked about
before in both our leaving

327
00:17:17,839 --> 00:17:20,359
episodes, you know your
shoulder.

328
00:17:20,359 --> 00:17:22,400
Shame in the ward.
Oh yeah, that's right, you.

329
00:17:22,520 --> 00:17:27,160
Know with your prom dress and my
legs that I was distracting the

330
00:17:27,160 --> 00:17:29,200
bishopric and the men sitting on
the stand.

331
00:17:29,200 --> 00:17:31,960
I mean, who even articulates
that?

332
00:17:31,960 --> 00:17:35,560
Of a child because you are a
child like a.

333
00:17:35,600 --> 00:17:42,800
Teen is a child, you know, it's
Yeah, you are just put in sexual

334
00:17:42,800 --> 00:17:49,880
terms from such a young age to
like, I don't know, you're old

335
00:17:49,880 --> 00:17:54,040
because there is no cut off
point it seems when you look at

336
00:17:54,040 --> 00:17:58,280
sexual assault with even older
women, like old age pensioners

337
00:17:58,280 --> 00:17:59,880
have been raped.
Absolutely.

338
00:17:59,880 --> 00:18:04,600
You know, and it was funny in
air quotes.

339
00:18:05,000 --> 00:18:10,760
The other week, I was walking to
a yoga class and my son, it was

340
00:18:10,760 --> 00:18:12,680
like, Mom, I don't know if
that's a good idea.

341
00:18:13,200 --> 00:18:17,000
I don't know if you do that.
And I was like, son, it's like a

342
00:18:17,000 --> 00:18:20,120
couple of blocks.
And I am old now.

343
00:18:20,320 --> 00:18:23,800
Because the horrifying thing is,
and my two daughters have noted

344
00:18:23,800 --> 00:18:28,720
this, that they got cat called
more as like a preteen and a

345
00:18:28,720 --> 00:18:32,520
teen than they do as adults.
Yeah, I that would be my

346
00:18:32,520 --> 00:18:35,440
experience as well.
I mean, I, I still get cat

347
00:18:35,440 --> 00:18:39,800
called, but it was pretty
intense when I like probably

348
00:18:39,800 --> 00:18:43,440
from the age of 11 or 12 till
early 20s.

349
00:18:43,440 --> 00:18:47,080
I would say more of it.
Yeah, which is like horrifying,

350
00:18:47,080 --> 00:18:50,000
disgusting on this occasion
where I was like, I'm going to

351
00:18:50,000 --> 00:18:52,920
walk to yoga and, you know, my
wee son was trying to be very

352
00:18:52,920 --> 00:18:54,400
lovely and I was like, it's
fine.

353
00:18:54,400 --> 00:18:56,880
Like I have reached the
invisible stage of life, which

354
00:18:56,880 --> 00:18:59,120
is wonderful, No?
Not to predators.

355
00:18:59,120 --> 00:19:03,400
No, I got about two blocks
before a man pulled up and said

356
00:19:03,400 --> 00:19:05,840
do you want to ride?
And I was like.

357
00:19:05,840 --> 00:19:07,640
No.
Fuck off.

358
00:19:07,840 --> 00:19:11,000
And like, you know, I think when
you're older, it's it's

359
00:19:11,000 --> 00:19:13,200
different than when you're like
a teen, right, Because it's,

360
00:19:13,200 --> 00:19:15,600
it's more nefarious and scary,
but it's still scary scary.

361
00:19:15,600 --> 00:19:19,280
It's still alarming.
And you're like, can I not walk

362
00:19:19,480 --> 00:19:24,600
two blocks right when I am
clearly like old enough to be

363
00:19:24,600 --> 00:19:27,560
your mother person?
That's asking like, what the

364
00:19:27,560 --> 00:19:29,840
hell?
And you know, another fucked up

365
00:19:29,840 --> 00:19:33,280
part of that is men think we
feel flattered.

366
00:19:33,880 --> 00:19:36,640
Yeah, that's right.
And even the nice guys, like I

367
00:19:36,640 --> 00:19:40,600
remember from a teen, you know,
from being a teen, where you,

368
00:19:41,000 --> 00:19:43,600
you would mention somebody cat
calling or saying something and

369
00:19:43,600 --> 00:19:46,680
they'd be like, oh, but it must
be flattering, no.

370
00:19:46,760 --> 00:19:48,840
Not when you're afraid for your
safety, It's not.

371
00:19:48,880 --> 00:19:50,760
Never.
Not when you're suddenly looking

372
00:19:50,760 --> 00:19:53,120
around, thinking, where are my
exits, right?

373
00:19:53,120 --> 00:19:56,040
Like, is there any help?
Like if I scream, who's going to

374
00:19:56,040 --> 00:19:59,160
hear me?
Exactly and you know I think

375
00:19:59,160 --> 00:20:02,760
just a data point to show high
on seriously any of that is

376
00:20:02,760 --> 00:20:06,120
taken.
Women have been told for decades

377
00:20:06,160 --> 00:20:10,080
shite fire right because
apparently shite ING help a man

378
00:20:10,080 --> 00:20:13,880
is touching me will not bring
people no reinforcements.

379
00:20:14,160 --> 00:20:18,880
It must be a fire right like.
What so fucked up It's.

380
00:20:19,000 --> 00:20:21,560
So fucked up.
Yeah, it's not good.

381
00:20:21,840 --> 00:20:23,240
It's not good, but it's not
good.

382
00:20:23,280 --> 00:20:25,960
You know, I do want to mention
maybe this is a good place to

383
00:20:25,960 --> 00:20:30,320
transition that we're talking a
lot about men, not not

384
00:20:30,320 --> 00:20:33,360
exclusively, but men we don't
know, strangers that are cat

385
00:20:33,360 --> 00:20:35,920
calling that are coming up and
offering us rides, that are

386
00:20:36,280 --> 00:20:39,520
groping us on trains or the
airport or like in a public

387
00:20:39,520 --> 00:20:42,240
space at a concert.
This has happened to me more

388
00:20:42,240 --> 00:20:44,600
times than I can actually count.
Like, I couldn't even make a

389
00:20:44,600 --> 00:20:47,120
list of incidents of how many
times I've been groped in a

390
00:20:47,120 --> 00:20:49,360
public space because it's so
pervasive.

391
00:20:49,920 --> 00:20:51,360
And, and sadly, you're not
alone.

392
00:20:51,600 --> 00:20:53,400
Right.
Yeah, that's not unique to me,

393
00:20:53,400 --> 00:20:55,520
friends.
That's nothing really to do

394
00:20:55,920 --> 00:20:58,080
about me except for the fact
that I'm a woman, right?

395
00:20:58,080 --> 00:21:02,880
So that is seems to be a target.
However, we should also mention

396
00:21:02,880 --> 00:21:06,600
that most rapes, sexual assaults
and physical violence are

397
00:21:06,600 --> 00:21:08,400
perpetrated on women by someone
they know.

398
00:21:08,400 --> 00:21:11,920
So not a stranger, not a drive
by groping, but an intimate

399
00:21:11,920 --> 00:21:16,960
partner or a family member.
Yeah, which is so disturbing

400
00:21:16,960 --> 00:21:21,480
because you believe that those
are the quote UN quote, safe men

401
00:21:22,240 --> 00:21:29,400
in your life and and yet they
are responsible for these

402
00:21:29,400 --> 00:21:35,120
terrible actions, either sexual
assault or death in some cases.

403
00:21:35,120 --> 00:21:38,080
And I think that's something to
highlight about this rape

404
00:21:38,080 --> 00:21:43,080
Academy, that most of it was how
do I drug and rape my partner?

405
00:21:43,080 --> 00:21:46,600
Yes, that's exactly what it was.
No, not strangers, partners.

406
00:21:46,600 --> 00:21:48,800
Yes.
And by the way, this is a

407
00:21:48,800 --> 00:21:52,520
worldwide phenomenon.
So, you know, statistics for

408
00:21:52,520 --> 00:21:56,160
rape and sexual assault
notoriously are a little bit

409
00:21:56,160 --> 00:21:59,000
tough, and they're probably all
underestimates because of the

410
00:21:59,000 --> 00:22:02,680
problem of reporting.
OK, Reporting can be very

411
00:22:02,680 --> 00:22:05,040
difficult for people.
There can be retaliation.

412
00:22:05,040 --> 00:22:08,720
There can be fear in some places
more than others, but including

413
00:22:08,720 --> 00:22:11,160
here in the United States.
So it's probably a massively

414
00:22:11,200 --> 00:22:15,200
underreported phenomenon.
That being said, worldwide it's

415
00:22:15,200 --> 00:22:18,440
estimated that at least a
minimum of one in three women

416
00:22:18,440 --> 00:22:22,880
have been physically abused or
raped and or raped, I should say

417
00:22:23,160 --> 00:22:25,360
most often by a partner or
family member.

418
00:22:25,800 --> 00:22:29,440
That is very high, extremely
high.

419
00:22:29,720 --> 00:22:34,880
And as you say, 1 in, you know,
3 is probably a very

420
00:22:34,880 --> 00:22:39,440
conservative estimate.
That's right, because I have

421
00:22:39,560 --> 00:22:42,760
personal experience of and also
know people that have personal

422
00:22:42,760 --> 00:22:51,040
experience of men who maybe have
harmed them in some way that by

423
00:22:51,040 --> 00:22:53,800
the time they even they don't
even get to the point of

424
00:22:53,800 --> 00:22:56,760
reporting it to another person
because the man is like that

425
00:22:56,760 --> 00:22:59,080
didn't happen.
Oh, right, the gas lighting.

426
00:22:59,080 --> 00:23:02,080
Yeah, the.
Gas lighting, particularly in

427
00:23:02,080 --> 00:23:04,520
this case of not a stranger, but
an intimate partner.

428
00:23:04,680 --> 00:23:07,520
Partner.
I had one partner that was like,

429
00:23:07,520 --> 00:23:09,680
if you bring this up, you'll
never see me again.

430
00:23:10,080 --> 00:23:14,240
And I was like, but but then
maybe you don't do shitty

431
00:23:14,240 --> 00:23:16,160
things.
And they were like, I've told

432
00:23:16,160 --> 00:23:19,560
you before, I have been accused
of this before, which should

433
00:23:19,560 --> 00:23:21,240
have been around.
Brad lied to me.

434
00:23:21,320 --> 00:23:24,840
Yeah.
And had, I later find out,

435
00:23:24,840 --> 00:23:27,800
multiple women accused of the
same thing.

436
00:23:27,800 --> 00:23:30,920
And the strategy there was to
just say it didn't happen,

437
00:23:31,240 --> 00:23:33,480
right?
And actually do something

438
00:23:33,480 --> 00:23:37,640
similar to what we've seen
lately in a mom talk story.

439
00:23:38,520 --> 00:23:41,480
Then flip it and be like.
She's crazy.

440
00:23:41,600 --> 00:23:42,640
Yeah, that's right.
She's.

441
00:23:42,640 --> 00:23:46,000
Crazy, I took this video.
Of her losing her shit, being

442
00:23:46,000 --> 00:23:51,120
crazy, yeah.
Which is why I was very much.

443
00:23:51,360 --> 00:23:54,440
I want to know what he did.
I'm not saying he did or didn't,

444
00:23:54,440 --> 00:23:58,080
although we do have more facts
now that he in fact did.

445
00:23:58,240 --> 00:24:01,680
Yeah, but I'm always skeptical.
Yeah, right.

446
00:24:01,680 --> 00:24:04,280
I mean, as far as that night, we
don't specifically know.

447
00:24:04,320 --> 00:24:08,520
However, is you know, we do have
evidence, physical evidence now

448
00:24:08,520 --> 00:24:11,200
the Taylor Frankie Paul was
physically abused by Dakota.

449
00:24:11,840 --> 00:24:13,280
Did she physically abuse him as
well?

450
00:24:13,280 --> 00:24:17,280
Seems like but also definitely
he was abusing her so.

451
00:24:17,720 --> 00:24:20,680
There, there, there it is.
There it was.

452
00:24:20,960 --> 00:24:22,680
Most of us, though, don't.
Don't fight back.

453
00:24:23,200 --> 00:24:27,200
Yeah, well, I mean, and there's
a multitude of reasons why, and

454
00:24:27,200 --> 00:24:31,760
I would suggest a big one is
confusion and disbelief.

455
00:24:32,000 --> 00:24:35,640
Absolutely.
I mean, that is what therapists,

456
00:24:35,640 --> 00:24:40,800
people more qualified than us,
say is one of the, you know, the

457
00:24:40,800 --> 00:24:44,720
main outcomes of abuse, mental
and physical, is confusion.

458
00:24:44,960 --> 00:24:47,600
Sure.
And so you doubt it happened?

459
00:24:47,600 --> 00:24:53,040
Also, I think a lot of men will
say it was in self-defense or I

460
00:24:53,040 --> 00:24:56,320
was restraining you or something
along those lines.

461
00:24:56,360 --> 00:24:59,360
Or they'll just purely gaslight
and say you're misremembering

462
00:24:59,360 --> 00:25:01,040
it.
It didn't happen in that way

463
00:25:01,160 --> 00:25:05,200
that you are saying, right?
I have the correct version,

464
00:25:05,600 --> 00:25:06,680
right.
That exonerates me.

465
00:25:06,680 --> 00:25:09,000
And let me impress that upon
you.

466
00:25:09,080 --> 00:25:12,080
Yeah.
And when we look at this

467
00:25:12,080 --> 00:25:17,440
Academy, I mean, a lot of women
were not even aware that it's

468
00:25:17,440 --> 00:25:18,680
happened to them.
Right.

469
00:25:18,680 --> 00:25:21,520
And that I think was maybe the
most horrifying and shocking

470
00:25:21,520 --> 00:25:24,480
part of that, especially, you
know, for you and I, we're

471
00:25:24,480 --> 00:25:27,600
definitely no stranger to this
phenomenon, I would say.

472
00:25:27,600 --> 00:25:32,520
But the widespread nature of
this quote rape Academy and the

473
00:25:32,520 --> 00:25:35,760
fact that this was violence
perpetrated against women who

474
00:25:35,760 --> 00:25:39,640
were largely unconscious
deliberately, right was was kind

475
00:25:39,640 --> 00:25:42,640
of the the shocking part.
And it wasn't actually shocking

476
00:25:42,640 --> 00:25:45,000
to me that that happened because
so I know what happened, but the

477
00:25:45,000 --> 00:25:49,600
number of people involved.
So we heard in one month 62

478
00:25:49,600 --> 00:25:52,440
million views of one of these
sites.

479
00:25:52,480 --> 00:25:54,840
And there are more than one, but
this is like the one that they

480
00:25:54,840 --> 00:26:00,000
sort of did the expose on.
There were over 20,000 videos of

481
00:26:00,000 --> 00:26:02,440
so-called sleep content on this
site.

482
00:26:02,800 --> 00:26:05,800
Sleep content, meaning you are
drugging your intimate partner

483
00:26:05,800 --> 00:26:08,080
and raping her while she is
asleep.

484
00:26:08,680 --> 00:26:10,960
And they mentioned specifically
that these quote I checked

485
00:26:10,960 --> 00:26:14,960
videos were among the most
popular where they would sort of

486
00:26:14,960 --> 00:26:18,600
lift the eyelids of their
unconscious partner to show that

487
00:26:18,600 --> 00:26:21,760
she's completely out, then
proceed to rape her and post

488
00:26:21,760 --> 00:26:23,800
this video on the Internet.
Wow.

489
00:26:24,600 --> 00:26:28,960
I mean, just wow on so many
levels.

490
00:26:29,200 --> 00:26:33,160
Yeah.
Like the level of perversion on

491
00:26:33,160 --> 00:26:39,240
just sick box that want to go
online and watch that content.

492
00:26:39,240 --> 00:26:41,520
These are sick bucks, and it's a
whole community, right, These

493
00:26:41,520 --> 00:26:44,800
message boards where they're
discussing strategies to do it.

494
00:26:44,800 --> 00:26:48,080
Yeah, I pulled a couple of
quotes from the CNN article.

495
00:26:48,080 --> 00:26:50,440
That's one of many articles that
were written about it.

496
00:26:50,560 --> 00:26:52,040
Yeah.
Do you mind if I read one of

497
00:26:52,040 --> 00:26:53,160
these?
Go on ahead.

498
00:26:53,160 --> 00:26:57,160
Okay, so this says quote when
Zoe Watts learned that her

499
00:26:57,160 --> 00:27:00,240
husband of 16 years had been
crushing her son's sleeping

500
00:27:00,240 --> 00:27:03,280
medicine into her tea and raping
her while she was passed out, it

501
00:27:03,280 --> 00:27:05,600
shattered her world.
Quote We worry about who's

502
00:27:05,600 --> 00:27:07,960
coming behind us walking down
the street or who's even

503
00:27:07,960 --> 00:27:10,720
friending us on Facebook.
You know, we worry about going

504
00:27:10,720 --> 00:27:13,480
to our car late at night in a
car park, but we don't worry

505
00:27:13,480 --> 00:27:16,400
about who you lie next to.
I didn't realize I had to.

506
00:27:16,400 --> 00:27:19,960
Watts said her Then husband's
confession came on an otherwise

507
00:27:19,960 --> 00:27:23,560
ordinary Sunday in 2018 after
the couple, who share four

508
00:27:23,560 --> 00:27:26,400
children, had returned from
Perch Quote.

509
00:27:26,400 --> 00:27:29,440
He reeled off a list of his
wrongdoings as if it was, you

510
00:27:29,440 --> 00:27:32,320
know, a shopping list.
He told her the abuse had been

511
00:27:32,320 --> 00:27:35,160
going on for years.
He just sort of said, I've been

512
00:27:35,160 --> 00:27:37,520
using our son's sleeping
medication to put in your last

513
00:27:37,520 --> 00:27:41,080
cup of tea at night to tie you
down, take photographs and rape

514
00:27:41,080 --> 00:27:43,440
you.
Her ex-husband is serving an 11

515
00:27:43,440 --> 00:27:45,920
year sentence for rape, sexual
assault by penetration and

516
00:27:45,920 --> 00:27:48,400
drugging.
My God.

517
00:27:48,720 --> 00:27:53,160
This was one of several similar
stories that were exposed in

518
00:27:53,160 --> 00:27:56,640
that article.
That is, there's no words for

519
00:27:56,640 --> 00:28:01,360
that like high on earth.
Would that poor woman ever trust

520
00:28:01,360 --> 00:28:02,720
again?
How could you?

521
00:28:02,960 --> 00:28:09,920
How could you ever trust like
that is just four children with

522
00:28:09,920 --> 00:28:13,520
somebody and they're doing that
and they're I'd like there's no

523
00:28:13,520 --> 00:28:14,960
words for.
That Yeah.

524
00:28:14,960 --> 00:28:19,360
And this, like, casual
confession after church, right?

525
00:28:19,720 --> 00:28:21,240
Like church, like, oh, hey,
just.

526
00:28:21,240 --> 00:28:24,360
And by the way, I've been raping
you in your sleep for the past

527
00:28:24,360 --> 00:28:25,680
several years.
No biggie.

528
00:28:25,960 --> 00:28:27,640
Yeah, no big deal.
No big deal.

529
00:28:27,840 --> 00:28:32,520
Oh my God.
Well, we had a a legislative

530
00:28:32,520 --> 00:28:35,280
member here in Utah, I believe a
couple of years ago.

531
00:28:35,280 --> 00:28:41,120
Who was proposing an oddly
specific bill that if your wife

532
00:28:41,120 --> 00:28:43,400
was unconscious and you had sex
with her, it wasn't?

533
00:28:43,440 --> 00:28:44,520
Rape.
What?

534
00:28:44,760 --> 00:28:47,120
Yeah, actually, I vaguely
remembered that.

535
00:28:47,120 --> 00:28:49,760
Remember that?
And I you're just like, wait,

536
00:28:50,040 --> 00:28:51,240
what?
Yeah, you're right.

537
00:28:51,240 --> 00:28:53,680
That is oddly specific.
You're like, are you telling on

538
00:28:53,680 --> 00:28:55,520
yourself, Sir?
Are you a little?

539
00:28:56,200 --> 00:28:57,840
Are you, Are you on Rape
Academy?

540
00:28:58,280 --> 00:29:00,200
Right.
Like why?

541
00:29:00,400 --> 00:29:02,480
Why would you propose that?
I believe.

542
00:29:02,520 --> 00:29:04,800
Thankfully it didn't pass, which
is me.

543
00:29:04,840 --> 00:29:09,480
Thank goodness the good news,
but it's also quite recent.

544
00:29:09,480 --> 00:29:14,400
I think it was like in the 80s
where it was actually declared

545
00:29:14,400 --> 00:29:16,480
not legal to rape your wife.
Like, right.

546
00:29:16,480 --> 00:29:21,200
I mean, it was very recent
history that apparently it was

547
00:29:21,200 --> 00:29:23,920
OK to to do that, conscious or
unconscious.

548
00:29:24,040 --> 00:29:26,480
Yeah, and I think there is still
that attitude.

549
00:29:26,480 --> 00:29:30,920
So in the same article from CNN,
it talked about, you know, the,

550
00:29:31,280 --> 00:29:35,160
I think it was the same woman,
like the battle to arrest and

551
00:29:35,320 --> 00:29:37,920
convict her husband.
She said she basically lost her

552
00:29:37,920 --> 00:29:41,080
entire social network and that
she got a lot of questions like,

553
00:29:41,080 --> 00:29:43,080
well, it's your husband, so why
does it matter?

554
00:29:43,160 --> 00:29:46,640
My God.
I know that was like, I'm

555
00:29:46,640 --> 00:29:47,840
shocked to my core.
Yes.

556
00:29:48,840 --> 00:29:53,160
It's like, do I not even deserve
to feel safe with the man who

557
00:29:53,160 --> 00:29:55,280
claims to love me and committed
my life?

558
00:29:55,280 --> 00:29:57,400
In my in my own home, in my own
bed.

559
00:29:58,080 --> 00:30:01,760
Like it's it's worse people,
it's worse.

560
00:30:01,800 --> 00:30:05,240
It's not better, it's worse,
Right?

561
00:30:06,000 --> 00:30:09,160
Yeah.
I mean, I don't personally

562
00:30:09,160 --> 00:30:11,840
understand.
I I get the people have kinks.

563
00:30:12,200 --> 00:30:16,960
I I totally Yep sure, all good.
Consensual kinks are great.

564
00:30:17,240 --> 00:30:19,920
This is not a consensual kink.
No.

565
00:30:19,920 --> 00:30:22,280
This is about power.
It's about harm.

566
00:30:22,440 --> 00:30:25,840
Yes, it's a bite.
Taking advantage of somebody

567
00:30:25,840 --> 00:30:27,960
who, you know, has implicit
trust in you.

568
00:30:28,120 --> 00:30:31,640
Yeah, that's very bad.
I hesitate to even call this a

569
00:30:31,640 --> 00:30:36,280
kink because it is just, well,
heck, I don't even have words

570
00:30:36,280 --> 00:30:38,920
for how disgusting this is.
I mean, when I think of kink, I

571
00:30:38,920 --> 00:30:41,440
think, oh, it's just something
kind of specific that, like,

572
00:30:41,440 --> 00:30:44,200
gets you off, and not
everybody's going to want to

573
00:30:44,200 --> 00:30:46,680
participate in that.
And that's fine, right?

574
00:30:46,680 --> 00:30:50,840
But like, if your kink is having
sex with someone who's asleep,

575
00:30:50,840 --> 00:30:53,600
then that could be a
conversation you had and prior

576
00:30:53,680 --> 00:30:55,960
consent given, right, Role play,
etcetera.

577
00:30:56,400 --> 00:30:57,720
But that's not what this is
about.

578
00:30:57,720 --> 00:30:59,680
Like you said, this is about
control.

579
00:30:59,680 --> 00:31:01,360
This is about that feeling of
power.

580
00:31:01,360 --> 00:31:02,360
Yes.
Yeah.

581
00:31:02,440 --> 00:31:07,920
And, and just complete and total
abuse and perversion 100% like

582
00:31:07,920 --> 00:31:13,680
it is, it is very bad.
And you know, I think, and this

583
00:31:14,160 --> 00:31:16,600
probably people would push back
on this.

584
00:31:16,680 --> 00:31:18,320
I think it's a conversation
worth having.

585
00:31:18,320 --> 00:31:23,080
You said something in one of our
previous podcasts that, you

586
00:31:23,080 --> 00:31:25,360
know, was a little more
lighthearted about terrible

587
00:31:25,360 --> 00:31:29,960
dating experiences.
But it really, it struck me so

588
00:31:29,960 --> 00:31:33,200
hard when I listened to it back.
I'm like, damn, Melissa Rella is

589
00:31:33,200 --> 00:31:38,920
a sage, which I always do.
I always knew this.

590
00:31:38,920 --> 00:31:43,320
But like though the way you
talked about it in terms of we'd

591
00:31:43,320 --> 00:31:48,120
been discussing the man who was
way off in left fields accusing

592
00:31:48,120 --> 00:31:50,640
me of already withholding sex we
had never had.

593
00:31:51,560 --> 00:31:55,440
Yeah, Mr. Short.
Stick yes, and you were like you

594
00:31:55,440 --> 00:32:02,000
know where does this entitlement
come to or come from that you

595
00:32:02,000 --> 00:32:05,440
are somehow if you were in
partnership, even just like

596
00:32:05,440 --> 00:32:10,120
loosely dating that you are I'm
high entitled to sexual

597
00:32:10,120 --> 00:32:13,920
relations from this woman.
Oh yeah, I remember how angry I

598
00:32:13,920 --> 00:32:15,400
was.
I was so pissed.

599
00:32:15,400 --> 00:32:17,560
I listened to that back too and
I was like, wow, I was really

600
00:32:17,560 --> 00:32:22,320
mad, which I wasn't really mad.
I mean, even the use, the use of

601
00:32:22,320 --> 00:32:27,280
the word withholding implies
that sex was something that he

602
00:32:27,520 --> 00:32:30,800
deserved from you, that he was
owed from you.

603
00:32:31,080 --> 00:32:35,000
Even in a very early stage of
dating where you're not

604
00:32:35,000 --> 00:32:38,280
exclusive, that for you to not
want to have sex was quote

605
00:32:38,280 --> 00:32:42,600
withholding it and somehow using
that as a tool of manipulation.

606
00:32:42,600 --> 00:32:47,200
I mean, that is wow, that is so
many disgusting, misogynistic,

607
00:32:47,360 --> 00:32:49,400
you know, things rolled up into
one.

608
00:32:49,400 --> 00:32:51,520
It's disgusting.
But what we're talking about

609
00:32:51,520 --> 00:32:54,240
today is that sense of
entitlement and we're seeing it

610
00:32:54,240 --> 00:32:56,440
with these husbands too.
They're like, Oh my wife is just

611
00:32:56,440 --> 00:32:59,120
my property I guess to like rape
as I see fit.

612
00:32:59,120 --> 00:33:04,640
Yeah, I, I can just go ahead and
and do this and it's it's fine

613
00:33:04,640 --> 00:33:08,640
because marriage is consent or
apparently just loose dating is

614
00:33:08,640 --> 00:33:12,280
also consent.
I yeah, yeah, I mean it to

615
00:33:12,280 --> 00:33:13,520
anyone.
Absolutely.

616
00:33:13,520 --> 00:33:17,160
I've run into this in committed
relationships as well, where it

617
00:33:17,160 --> 00:33:21,560
was assumed to be my duty to put
out.

618
00:33:21,680 --> 00:33:25,600
Yeah.
As often, you know, as as he

619
00:33:25,600 --> 00:33:26,320
wanted.
Yeah.

620
00:33:26,440 --> 00:33:27,720
And.
And not just to put out,

621
00:33:27,720 --> 00:33:30,280
actually, but to initiate it.
Oh my God.

622
00:33:30,280 --> 00:33:32,800
Essentially every night at 8:15,
Right.

623
00:33:33,400 --> 00:33:34,680
Like.
Etcetera, etcetera.

624
00:33:34,720 --> 00:33:35,800
Watch.
Yeah, right.

625
00:33:35,800 --> 00:33:39,640
And if I if I wasn't doing so,
then I was failing in my duties,

626
00:33:39,640 --> 00:33:41,480
right?
My God, what this person

627
00:33:41,480 --> 00:33:44,560
apparently thought he was owed.
Yeah, that's.

628
00:33:44,800 --> 00:33:47,400
With no effort right on his
part, so.

629
00:33:47,600 --> 00:33:49,840
You're here to service.
It's like a car.

630
00:33:49,840 --> 00:33:53,720
You're here to service a car.
Yeah, I'm like am am IA sex toy

631
00:33:53,920 --> 00:33:55,440
like am I just like your
Fleshlight?

632
00:33:55,440 --> 00:33:57,080
Like what?
Come on now.

633
00:33:57,440 --> 00:34:01,640
I am so sorry that it's and this
is all these would be the men

634
00:34:01,640 --> 00:34:03,720
that would describe themselves
as the good guys.

635
00:34:03,960 --> 00:34:07,000
Yes, the the good guys.
I would never do anything like

636
00:34:07,000 --> 00:34:09,679
that right.
You could argue this is a on a

637
00:34:09,679 --> 00:34:11,639
spectrum.
It's on a spectrum.

638
00:34:11,639 --> 00:34:18,400
The root, the core is the same
entitlement, access to women,

639
00:34:19,400 --> 00:34:23,400
all of the same things like the
route is the same.

640
00:34:23,560 --> 00:34:29,440
Yes, because I don't know that
I've ever a schedule, demand or

641
00:34:29,440 --> 00:34:34,880
demanded that I be satisfied a
certain amount of times per

642
00:34:34,880 --> 00:34:38,360
week.
I've heard a lot of women you

643
00:34:38,360 --> 00:34:42,040
know I had a friend who was
getting married and pre marriage

644
00:34:42,080 --> 00:34:45,520
he basically wrote it down and
said here is the expectation for

645
00:34:45,520 --> 00:34:46,400
sex.
Yes.

646
00:34:46,600 --> 00:34:49,760
And I mean, I've heard from many
women that this is the case as

647
00:34:49,760 --> 00:34:52,800
well.
And I, I think there's something

648
00:34:52,800 --> 00:34:55,560
else going on here as well.
I don't think it is that women

649
00:34:55,560 --> 00:34:58,880
necessarily have lower sex
drives, although there are times

650
00:34:58,880 --> 00:35:01,600
when that can be true, such as
when you've just given birth.

651
00:35:02,040 --> 00:35:04,200
I mean, the number of women I've
told me that are like, oh, their

652
00:35:04,200 --> 00:35:06,920
husbands are like pissed because
they're not putting out.

653
00:35:06,920 --> 00:35:10,280
Like after two months or three
months, you're like, you're not

654
00:35:10,280 --> 00:35:12,640
even healed down there.
Like no, right?

655
00:35:12,800 --> 00:35:17,920
Do do they have any idea how it
feels to push a large object out

656
00:35:18,040 --> 00:35:20,400
of your vagina?
It's like a bowling ball, right?

657
00:35:20,400 --> 00:35:23,320
Like, come on now, my God,
right?

658
00:35:23,320 --> 00:35:25,160
But.
It's so hard for them.

659
00:35:25,320 --> 00:35:28,840
Yeah, it's so hard for me that I
haven't had sex for a few

660
00:35:28,840 --> 00:35:29,600
months.
Wow.

661
00:35:30,320 --> 00:35:31,400
Right.
Yeah.

662
00:35:31,400 --> 00:35:33,480
You're like, get a toy, use your
hand, something.

663
00:35:33,480 --> 00:35:36,640
But like, you're not owed sex by
this woman who just, you know,

664
00:35:37,360 --> 00:35:40,480
pushed a baby out of her vagina.
And also, you're a baby, right?

665
00:35:40,480 --> 00:35:43,320
You're a baby who probably
actually hasn't slept really

666
00:35:43,320 --> 00:35:46,800
since then, right, More than a
couple hours at a time, and who

667
00:35:46,800 --> 00:35:50,280
is constantly being, like,
touched and sucked on by another

668
00:35:50,280 --> 00:35:53,280
human, which is great, but also
makes you maybe less likely to

669
00:35:53,280 --> 00:35:55,920
want to be touched and sucked on
by another human after you've

670
00:35:55,920 --> 00:35:58,520
put one of them to bed.
Yeah, right.

671
00:35:58,640 --> 00:36:02,720
That's a real phenomenon.
That is fair, and I mean you.

672
00:36:02,880 --> 00:36:06,400
You are the science person in
our beautiful Joe.

673
00:36:07,120 --> 00:36:11,240
I would imagine that some aspect
of that is nature, right?

674
00:36:11,240 --> 00:36:14,760
Like you're in those early
stages, you're raising your

675
00:36:14,760 --> 00:36:17,600
young.
You are, you know, feeding your

676
00:36:17,640 --> 00:36:20,800
young your your body is kind of
doing a different thing.

677
00:36:20,960 --> 00:36:24,080
Yeah, for that, that little
short period of time.

678
00:36:24,080 --> 00:36:26,600
And I also think it's just
exhausted when you're growing

679
00:36:26,600 --> 00:36:29,160
this little human.
So that's that's one phenomenon.

680
00:36:29,160 --> 00:36:33,120
I think another phenomenon,
though, I this might even be a

681
00:36:33,120 --> 00:36:38,440
whole episode, I'm not sure, is
this idea that sex, and I'm just

682
00:36:38,440 --> 00:36:39,920
going to talk through this.
So I don't think this is going

683
00:36:39,920 --> 00:36:43,120
to be very articulate, right?
But essentially putting the

684
00:36:43,120 --> 00:36:46,960
penis into the vagina and
ejaculating is sex and

685
00:36:46,960 --> 00:36:51,200
everything else is foreplay.
OK, including whatever like gets

686
00:36:51,200 --> 00:36:54,040
the woman off OK.
And for a lot of women, many

687
00:36:54,040 --> 00:36:58,120
women, the majority of women,
you need some stimulation of the

688
00:36:58,120 --> 00:37:00,240
clitoris to actually orgasm,
right?

689
00:37:00,240 --> 00:37:04,560
So not, not all women can come
simply by vaginal penetration.

690
00:37:04,560 --> 00:37:07,000
In fact, it's probably the
minority that could come only

691
00:37:07,000 --> 00:37:10,480
from that, right?
So the kind of branding that

692
00:37:10,480 --> 00:37:14,280
like the sex, like the real
event is the man ejaculating.

693
00:37:14,320 --> 00:37:16,920
So it's his pleasure and
everything else is quote

694
00:37:16,920 --> 00:37:19,440
foreplay, right?
I think that's really

695
00:37:19,440 --> 00:37:22,840
problematic, right?
And it, I don't know if I'm

696
00:37:22,840 --> 00:37:26,360
explaining this well, but it
reflects an attitude that the

697
00:37:26,360 --> 00:37:28,440
man's pleasure is paramount.
Yeah.

698
00:37:28,440 --> 00:37:31,160
And that the woman's is either
superfluous or maybe a nice

699
00:37:31,160 --> 00:37:32,000
bonus.
Yeah.

700
00:37:32,000 --> 00:37:33,240
What do you think about that
bonus?

701
00:37:34,280 --> 00:37:37,280
You were very articulate and
very clear.

702
00:37:37,280 --> 00:37:43,600
And I think there are I mean,
it's just like a a story.

703
00:37:43,800 --> 00:37:46,040
It's it's almost like a cultural
myth, right?

704
00:37:46,040 --> 00:37:49,840
Thing you're so old that that's
that's what sex looks like and

705
00:37:49,840 --> 00:37:52,520
that's the end result.
And yeah, it didn't happen.

706
00:37:52,520 --> 00:37:57,840
Intimacy didn't happen unless it
ends with that event, right?

707
00:37:58,240 --> 00:38:02,240
Which is, of course, essential
to conceiving a child.

708
00:38:02,240 --> 00:38:04,760
But the most?
The time we ain't doing.

709
00:38:04,760 --> 00:38:08,400
That we're not doing that, That
is not the intent.

710
00:38:08,640 --> 00:38:11,760
That is not in fact, you're
probably trying to actively

711
00:38:11,840 --> 00:38:15,200
prevent that.
Yes, the majority of times, men

712
00:38:15,200 --> 00:38:19,240
and women alike.
And yeah, I, it's all

713
00:38:19,240 --> 00:38:22,800
fundamental to understanding how
on earth things like this can

714
00:38:22,800 --> 00:38:25,280
happen.
It's, it's nipping that shit in

715
00:38:25,280 --> 00:38:28,600
the bud, not shutting down the
rape academies, but actually

716
00:38:28,600 --> 00:38:33,040
changing the way we think about
women, that we think about sex.

717
00:38:33,040 --> 00:38:37,320
I was listening to a podcast the
other day and I must go back.

718
00:38:37,320 --> 00:38:42,000
It was just auto playing many
podcasts as I typically do, but

719
00:38:42,000 --> 00:38:45,400
they were talking about the the
myths around the female orgasm.

720
00:38:46,080 --> 00:38:51,720
And I remember like vividly, I
don't believe a person sat me

721
00:38:51,720 --> 00:38:54,200
down and told me it one day.
But this idea, particularly if

722
00:38:54,200 --> 00:38:58,560
you were trying to get pregnant,
that if you orgasm, there's a

723
00:38:58,560 --> 00:39:02,000
better chance of getting
pregnant, you know, because you

724
00:39:02,000 --> 00:39:06,120
will help help the sperm along
its way to find the egg.

725
00:39:06,200 --> 00:39:13,360
And hello, the reverse is true
it it rejects and expels things

726
00:39:13,480 --> 00:39:17,960
from your body, which is why
orgasms can feel great when

727
00:39:17,960 --> 00:39:21,520
you're having period cramps.
Oh, my God, it feels so good.

728
00:39:21,520 --> 00:39:22,880
Thank you.
Yes.

729
00:39:22,880 --> 00:39:25,760
Like the first two days, yes.
It's like, yeah, I guess it's a

730
00:39:25,760 --> 00:39:27,680
mess.
But just like, like, come to the

731
00:39:27,680 --> 00:39:29,440
shower and just, like pound it
out.

732
00:39:29,440 --> 00:39:30,560
It feels so good.
Right.

733
00:39:30,560 --> 00:39:37,560
Because it literally contracts
and, you know, and I'm just in

734
00:39:37,560 --> 00:39:41,440
disbelief that I thought this
was correct for like most of my

735
00:39:41,440 --> 00:39:43,920
adult life.
And then you're like, wait a

736
00:39:43,920 --> 00:39:45,880
second.
That's right.

737
00:39:45,880 --> 00:39:51,400
Like it's actually expelling,
not drawing in.

738
00:39:51,480 --> 00:39:54,840
So I don't know.
It's just wild to think about

739
00:39:54,880 --> 00:39:59,680
it, all the myths that are out
there surrounding sex.

740
00:39:59,920 --> 00:40:05,040
A lot of myths I and I really
like hate the deemphasis of of

741
00:40:05,040 --> 00:40:07,440
the female orgasm.
Yeah, sidebar.

742
00:40:07,520 --> 00:40:10,040
I feel like an orgasm is also a
great headache care most of the

743
00:40:10,040 --> 00:40:12,160
time.
It's, it's a good cure for most

744
00:40:12,160 --> 00:40:14,560
things.
Yeah, honestly, I know, right?

745
00:40:14,920 --> 00:40:19,120
And it's, you know, little,
little sidebar from talking

746
00:40:19,120 --> 00:40:22,280
about this serious topic, but
you know, how come it's like

747
00:40:22,280 --> 00:40:25,200
always achievable 100% of the
time by yourself?

748
00:40:25,400 --> 00:40:26,720
I know, right?
Always during sex.

749
00:40:27,080 --> 00:40:28,800
Yeah.
Yeah, Yeah.

750
00:40:29,000 --> 00:40:30,440
Interesting.
I know.

751
00:40:30,520 --> 00:40:31,920
There's there's a reason.
Yeah.

752
00:40:32,680 --> 00:40:35,080
Interesting stuff.
So yeah.

753
00:40:35,280 --> 00:40:37,240
All right, so back to our topic.
Yep.

754
00:40:39,240 --> 00:40:40,040
Yeah.
Rape Academy.

755
00:40:40,040 --> 00:40:42,600
Which, to be clear, of course we
should be shutting this down.

756
00:40:42,640 --> 00:40:43,760
Yeah.
What?

757
00:40:43,760 --> 00:40:45,000
Did happen.
I never knew.

758
00:40:45,000 --> 00:40:47,240
Like I heard about it but I
didn't hear next steps.

759
00:40:47,240 --> 00:40:49,200
Did you hear next steps?
I'm not sure if I heard next

760
00:40:49,200 --> 00:40:51,040
steps that might still be in
progress.

761
00:40:51,040 --> 00:40:53,200
Yeah, I kind of just read a
couple of the exposes.

762
00:40:53,680 --> 00:40:56,000
Yeah.
I mean, you would imagine as as

763
00:40:56,000 --> 00:40:58,880
you noted earlier, this isn't
the only one.

764
00:40:59,360 --> 00:41:02,600
No, no.
I mean, there's stuff sort of

765
00:41:02,600 --> 00:41:05,000
everywhere.
I mean, and I think we have to

766
00:41:05,000 --> 00:41:09,000
mention Giselle Pelico, right,
in France.

767
00:41:09,000 --> 00:41:12,080
So that wasn't from this rape
Academy site, as I understand

768
00:41:12,080 --> 00:41:13,520
it.
That was a separate Internet

769
00:41:13,520 --> 00:41:16,560
community sort of focused on the
same thing, right?

770
00:41:16,560 --> 00:41:19,880
And if you don't remember that
case, although I doubt anyone's

771
00:41:19,880 --> 00:41:22,360
forgotten, but just in case you
don't recognize the name,

772
00:41:23,040 --> 00:41:27,240
Giselle Pelico was raped by at
least 50 men, facilitated by her

773
00:41:27,240 --> 00:41:31,120
husband, who drugged her to be
unconscious and then invited men

774
00:41:31,120 --> 00:41:34,240
over to rape her.
And at least 50 men, we should

775
00:41:34,240 --> 00:41:36,320
say.
So her husband Dominique and I

776
00:41:36,320 --> 00:41:38,200
think 50 other people were
convicted.

777
00:41:38,480 --> 00:41:39,960
Horrific.
Horrific.

778
00:41:40,120 --> 00:41:43,280
I'm glad they were convicted
because let's face it, it

779
00:41:43,280 --> 00:41:45,360
doesn't always happen that they
are.

780
00:41:45,520 --> 00:41:49,000
Well, it doesn't, but Giselle in
like, in addition to being

781
00:41:49,000 --> 00:41:52,800
incredibly brave and strong, I
mean, God, our hats are off to

782
00:41:52,800 --> 00:41:55,560
her.
But in terms of a legal case,

783
00:41:55,960 --> 00:41:59,800
she was lucky in the sense and
only in the sense that her

784
00:41:59,800 --> 00:42:02,480
husband had saved video.
So there was a mountain of

785
00:42:02,480 --> 00:42:05,640
evidence.
It was not just her saying it or

786
00:42:05,640 --> 00:42:09,200
being like, oh, I think
something happened or whatever.

787
00:42:09,800 --> 00:42:14,960
She had a huge pile of evidence
that she submitted to the court

788
00:42:14,960 --> 00:42:17,160
and it was very damning and it
was very clear.

789
00:42:17,160 --> 00:42:20,120
Yeah, so.
It's I think one of the most

790
00:42:20,240 --> 00:42:24,640
horrifying aspects of that
particular case was, as I

791
00:42:24,640 --> 00:42:28,200
remember, she lived in sort of
like a reasonably small

792
00:42:28,200 --> 00:42:30,400
community.
Like it wasn't like she was

793
00:42:30,400 --> 00:42:34,920
living in a major city.
And so you would imagine most of

794
00:42:34,920 --> 00:42:38,720
these men knew her, or she knew
them, or of them.

795
00:42:38,720 --> 00:42:41,000
Maybe.
I'm not sure because he

796
00:42:41,000 --> 00:42:44,200
definitely was soliciting this
over the Internet.

797
00:42:44,200 --> 00:42:48,720
So people might have driven to,
you know, do that necessarily,

798
00:42:48,760 --> 00:42:50,920
not necessarily in the same
town.

799
00:42:50,920 --> 00:42:54,080
I'm not, I'm actually not sure,
but I think he was mostly

800
00:42:54,080 --> 00:42:57,080
getting these people from this
this Internet community.

801
00:42:57,080 --> 00:43:01,360
Oh.
My God, I just cannot like the

802
00:43:01,400 --> 00:43:07,200
psychological distress for her
of not remembering, of not

803
00:43:07,200 --> 00:43:12,400
knowing of Oh my God, what state
is my sexual health in here, you

804
00:43:12,400 --> 00:43:13,000
know?
Yeah.

805
00:43:13,000 --> 00:43:16,640
And then watching those videos
with you, your unconscious self

806
00:43:16,640 --> 00:43:19,640
is the star.
Horrific, Horrific.

807
00:43:19,760 --> 00:43:23,200
Absolutely horrific.
Yeah.

808
00:43:23,960 --> 00:43:26,760
It's it's just wild to
contemplate.

809
00:43:26,920 --> 00:43:37,280
I should mention maybe I am in
hindsight believe there may have

810
00:43:37,480 --> 00:43:41,640
been two occasions where a
partner put something in my

811
00:43:41,640 --> 00:43:42,840
drink.
Oh no.

812
00:43:42,840 --> 00:43:48,120
But I don't, you know, it's just
been more sort of putting things

813
00:43:48,120 --> 00:43:53,240
together and things not making
sense or reaction to a drink not

814
00:43:53,240 --> 00:43:57,240
making sense in hindsight.
I could be totally wrong, I

815
00:43:57,240 --> 00:44:00,960
could be totally wrong.
But with all of these things

816
00:44:00,960 --> 00:44:03,800
coming out or happening, you're
just, and I'm not saying that

817
00:44:03,800 --> 00:44:07,720
that's what occurred as a
result, because I actually have

818
00:44:07,720 --> 00:44:10,200
some different ideas around that
given the timing of it.

819
00:44:10,720 --> 00:44:16,520
It was more to, you know, maybe
make me unavailable, but it's

820
00:44:16,520 --> 00:44:23,560
just so harrowing that there are
chunks out of people's lives

821
00:44:23,560 --> 00:44:27,040
that they had no awareness that
this was happening on top of the

822
00:44:27,040 --> 00:44:28,480
fact that this actually
happened.

823
00:44:28,480 --> 00:44:31,080
Like, it's multiple layers.
Absolutely.

824
00:44:31,080 --> 00:44:35,960
It's crazy to just, I mean, who
is thinking of this?

825
00:44:35,960 --> 00:44:39,000
Who is thinking that this is an
OK thing to do?

826
00:44:39,000 --> 00:44:43,000
Well, I mean a number of people
with over 20,000 videos and 62

827
00:44:43,000 --> 00:44:46,680
million views of them.
Let me read you another quote

828
00:44:46,680 --> 00:44:49,720
because this kind of goes back
to what you were saying before

829
00:44:49,720 --> 00:44:54,360
from the CNN expose quote.
After waking up a few times to

830
00:44:54,360 --> 00:44:58,960
her partner violently raping
her, this woman, last name

831
00:44:58,960 --> 00:45:01,800
Stanhope, knew something was
wrong and asked him to stop.

832
00:45:02,040 --> 00:45:04,080
Instead, she said she was
gaslit.

833
00:45:04,360 --> 00:45:06,680
He would then turn on me and
say, well, you're on too much

834
00:45:06,680 --> 00:45:08,400
medication, you must be
imagining it.

835
00:45:08,400 --> 00:45:10,400
That doesn't happen.
You're mental.

836
00:45:10,480 --> 00:45:13,240
You're crazy.
Wow, here we get the trope of

837
00:45:13,240 --> 00:45:16,400
the crazy woman again.
Wow, exactly.

838
00:45:17,080 --> 00:45:20,880
Turns out, yeah, turns like she
was.

839
00:45:21,000 --> 00:45:24,560
Not she was not.
No, she was being raped.

840
00:45:25,280 --> 00:45:28,160
Which she suspected was actually
happening.

841
00:45:28,160 --> 00:45:29,880
Yeah, which it was actually
happening.

842
00:45:30,520 --> 00:45:32,120
Unbelievable.
Unbelievable.

843
00:45:32,240 --> 00:45:35,320
Yeah.
Maybe we should talk about,

844
00:45:35,320 --> 00:45:39,760
like, some of these drugs.
I was at the dive shop I go to

845
00:45:39,760 --> 00:45:42,360
the other day and love, love
this place.

846
00:45:42,600 --> 00:45:43,960
Oh, my God.
The owner, Laurie, such a

847
00:45:43,960 --> 00:45:45,320
delight.
She's so great.

848
00:45:45,320 --> 00:45:47,560
That's so cool.
But one of the dive pros was

849
00:45:47,560 --> 00:45:50,680
there and he was.
He's a great guy too, actually.

850
00:45:50,680 --> 00:45:53,040
He was like, you know what?
Where do people even, like, get

851
00:45:53,040 --> 00:45:54,720
these drugs?
And I was like, that's actually

852
00:45:54,720 --> 00:45:56,240
a good question.
Yeah, I don't know.

853
00:45:56,240 --> 00:45:59,080
I'm going to go like dig a
little bit in the Internet.

854
00:45:59,360 --> 00:46:02,680
I know what they are like.
The lay person with no medical

855
00:46:02,680 --> 00:46:04,120
experience.
Yeah, well, I guess.

856
00:46:04,120 --> 00:46:07,720
They are on the rape Academy
getting tips and checks from

857
00:46:07,720 --> 00:46:12,360
other men.
So they talked to someone or at

858
00:46:12,360 --> 00:46:15,040
least on the message board,
there was a user who had a

859
00:46:15,040 --> 00:46:20,960
business and he was based in
Spain, I think.

860
00:46:21,360 --> 00:46:27,240
And he was offering these drugs
for like ���150 and he would just

861
00:46:27,240 --> 00:46:29,920
package them and send them to
people.

862
00:46:30,800 --> 00:46:35,200
But also I think that probably
the main source is, is kind of

863
00:46:36,240 --> 00:46:38,880
people that are selling
prescription drugs, right?

864
00:46:38,880 --> 00:46:41,400
So they've bought them from
someone or they've stolen them

865
00:46:41,400 --> 00:46:43,080
or like whatever and then
they're selling them.

866
00:46:43,520 --> 00:46:46,760
So in terms of date rape drugs,
we've all heard of roofies.

867
00:46:46,760 --> 00:46:49,160
Yes.
Now, that particular drug,

868
00:46:49,560 --> 00:46:53,760
Rohypnol, I think is the the
brand name or whatever.

869
00:46:54,080 --> 00:46:57,680
I think that one's not so common
in the United States, but

870
00:46:57,680 --> 00:47:00,520
there's other benzos that work
similarly.

871
00:47:00,840 --> 00:47:03,720
So GHB would be one of the main
ones.

872
00:47:03,720 --> 00:47:06,920
That's gamma hydroxy butyric
acid that's used as a

873
00:47:06,920 --> 00:47:09,640
recreational drug.
OK, so that's like lollipops or

874
00:47:09,640 --> 00:47:13,160
whatever, but it's also used as
a date rape drug, particularly

875
00:47:13,160 --> 00:47:15,080
if it's in combination with
alcohol.

876
00:47:15,080 --> 00:47:16,360
That's going to knock you right
out.

877
00:47:16,960 --> 00:47:19,040
Yeah, that.
Wow.

878
00:47:21,160 --> 00:47:22,720
Right.
There's a bunch of other benzos,

879
00:47:22,720 --> 00:47:26,000
sleeping pills, and again,
particularly when mixed with

880
00:47:26,000 --> 00:47:29,120
alcohol, a lot of these have a
pretty sedative effect.

881
00:47:29,120 --> 00:47:32,120
So you can absolutely imagine
that this could happen and you

882
00:47:32,120 --> 00:47:33,840
would not be aware, you wouldn't
wake up.

883
00:47:34,080 --> 00:47:37,080
Yeah, I mean, you would have no
knowledge that anything

884
00:47:37,080 --> 00:47:40,280
happened, which is the really
frightening part.

885
00:47:40,360 --> 00:47:44,760
I, you know, even if you've had
a, a rough night with alcohol,

886
00:47:45,080 --> 00:47:48,720
you know, you can the next day
be like, Oh my God, what, what,

887
00:47:48,960 --> 00:47:51,920
what did I do then?
But yes, like mixed with

888
00:47:51,920 --> 00:47:54,840
something potentially like this,
I mean, it's, it's just

889
00:47:54,840 --> 00:47:56,680
horrifying.
Yeah, and we should probably say

890
00:47:56,680 --> 00:47:59,760
alcohol's likely the most the
number one date rape drug, if

891
00:47:59,760 --> 00:48:02,000
you will, right?
And, and that one's on a

892
00:48:02,000 --> 00:48:05,200
spectrum, right?
Like if you're have enough that

893
00:48:05,200 --> 00:48:08,000
you're blackout, sometimes
there's opportunistic people

894
00:48:08,000 --> 00:48:11,080
that will take advantage, so.
Isn't it interesting that like

895
00:48:11,080 --> 00:48:17,200
I've even seen on men think this
is funny on dating profiles

896
00:48:17,200 --> 00:48:21,040
where they say if you don't look
like your picture, you're buying

897
00:48:21,040 --> 00:48:23,480
the drinks until you.
Do Oh yeah, I've seen that a

898
00:48:23,480 --> 00:48:26,440
bunch of times.
And you're like, ha ha, ha ha,

899
00:48:26,480 --> 00:48:27,480
but you know.
Swipe left.

900
00:48:27,480 --> 00:48:29,960
Yeah, Yeah, every time.
But there's this idea that,

901
00:48:29,960 --> 00:48:34,320
like, you know, women, they just
want to go on dates so men will

902
00:48:34,320 --> 00:48:38,960
buy them food and drinks.
Sorry, Irish accent there, you

903
00:48:38,960 --> 00:48:45,400
know, But at the same time, men
also may have historically

904
00:48:45,560 --> 00:48:48,640
bought women a lot of drinks to
get them into the state.

905
00:48:48,680 --> 00:48:51,840
Yep.
So help.

906
00:48:52,160 --> 00:48:55,560
Yeah.
What is the answer here?

907
00:48:55,760 --> 00:48:59,080
Like what it what is what is
even happening?

908
00:48:59,560 --> 00:49:03,280
Yeah, it's it's wild.
It's wild stuff.

909
00:49:03,960 --> 00:49:10,600
I mean, I think it's probably
worth talking about what what

910
00:49:10,600 --> 00:49:16,800
are the solutions here?
You know, like how do we stop

911
00:49:16,800 --> 00:49:19,040
this from happening?
How do we stop this being an

912
00:49:19,040 --> 00:49:22,400
option?
Because in reality, closing

913
00:49:22,400 --> 00:49:26,080
down, shutting down these
websites isn't the issue that

914
00:49:26,080 --> 00:49:29,320
you just show system clearly or
sorry isn't the answer not the

915
00:49:29,320 --> 00:49:32,080
issue.
The judicial system is clearly

916
00:49:32,080 --> 00:49:36,680
not the answer either.
So like where does this problem

917
00:49:36,680 --> 00:49:38,520
start?
Where does it begin?

918
00:49:39,160 --> 00:49:43,480
That is a great question.
And I think that this is kind of

919
00:49:43,480 --> 00:49:47,200
rooted in once again, our
patriarchal culture, right?

920
00:49:47,200 --> 00:49:51,560
So this is deeply rooted, these
attitudes against women that

921
00:49:51,560 --> 00:49:57,000
eventually can manifest as
violence and and rape and sexual

922
00:49:57,000 --> 00:50:00,680
assault.
But I would say that, you know,

923
00:50:00,680 --> 00:50:03,360
for our men propping up the
system, even if you personally

924
00:50:03,360 --> 00:50:06,440
would never harm a woman, you're
still contributing to this this

925
00:50:06,440 --> 00:50:10,000
problem if you're sort of
participating in this like bro

926
00:50:10,000 --> 00:50:14,600
code bro culture, because this
is what facilitates this

927
00:50:14,600 --> 00:50:17,240
happening, right?
I mean, you mentioned like the

928
00:50:17,240 --> 00:50:20,880
judicial system and, and you're
right, that's a problem.

929
00:50:20,880 --> 00:50:24,440
And that's one reason why rapes
are are severely underreported

930
00:50:24,440 --> 00:50:27,240
because there's this issue of
I'm not going to be believed,

931
00:50:27,240 --> 00:50:28,720
right?
It's a he said, she said

932
00:50:28,720 --> 00:50:31,480
situation.
Or even if there's evidence,

933
00:50:31,480 --> 00:50:33,960
right, like how many rape kits
are just sitting in fridges

934
00:50:33,960 --> 00:50:36,440
totally unexamined.
We know that that is a rampant

935
00:50:36,440 --> 00:50:38,960
problem in the United States.
And then it's.

936
00:50:38,960 --> 00:50:40,960
Too late.
Yeah, right.

937
00:50:41,360 --> 00:50:45,520
So yeah, that's tough.
And you ask a difficult

938
00:50:45,520 --> 00:50:47,320
question, like, how do we unwind
this?

939
00:50:47,960 --> 00:50:50,200
I, I don't know.
I mean, this is a societal

940
00:50:50,200 --> 00:50:52,560
problem that is pretty hard to
get at.

941
00:50:53,040 --> 00:50:57,480
But I think we see some things
that I would say exacerbate or

942
00:50:57,480 --> 00:51:01,320
facilitate or enable these kinds
of behavior.

943
00:51:01,320 --> 00:51:03,680
And one of them is kind of this
bro code, right?

944
00:51:03,680 --> 00:51:06,120
Like, don't tell on your Bros,
right?

945
00:51:06,120 --> 00:51:11,040
Like just don't notice how your
buddy treats women or responds

946
00:51:11,040 --> 00:51:13,280
to women.
And you see that every time

947
00:51:13,280 --> 00:51:16,800
there is like a high profile
case, like, for example, Brett

948
00:51:16,800 --> 00:51:19,960
Kavanaugh, right, right.
Lots of men come into his

949
00:51:19,960 --> 00:51:22,680
defense and some women, by the
way, you know, Amy Chua, the

950
00:51:22,680 --> 00:51:25,520
tiger mom wrote an op-ed
defending him and did not

951
00:51:25,520 --> 00:51:28,240
retract it even when a lot of
people did, you know, flocking

952
00:51:28,240 --> 00:51:30,520
to his defense.
And what you'll hear a lot is,

953
00:51:30,520 --> 00:51:32,280
oh, I've never seen him behave
that way.

954
00:51:32,520 --> 00:51:35,320
And it's like, yeah, well, you
wouldn't because he's doing that

955
00:51:35,320 --> 00:51:37,200
like to women behind closed
doors.

956
00:51:37,360 --> 00:51:40,920
Yeah, like he's not just, you
know, walking into the office,

957
00:51:40,960 --> 00:51:41,400
right?
Like.

958
00:51:41,400 --> 00:51:43,760
He's not doing that in court,
for example, right?

959
00:51:43,760 --> 00:51:46,880
So maybe you haven't seen it,
but that doesn't mean it's not

960
00:51:46,920 --> 00:51:49,440
happening, right?
So this refusal to believe

961
00:51:49,440 --> 00:51:54,880
women, yes #1 right.
That's a really good place to

962
00:51:54,880 --> 00:52:00,320
start, you know, in terms of
well, and also the assumption

963
00:52:00,320 --> 00:52:05,400
that, you know, if you are
making out with somebody or, you

964
00:52:05,400 --> 00:52:09,800
know, getting to know somebody,
that that's just a reasonable

965
00:52:09,800 --> 00:52:12,000
expectation that they can push
as far as they want.

966
00:52:12,600 --> 00:52:16,600
And I remember as, you know, a
teenager and young adult,

967
00:52:17,520 --> 00:52:20,360
knowing that I didn't want to do
certain things or I wasn't ready

968
00:52:20,360 --> 00:52:25,320
to do certain things and always
being aware of, will, how, how

969
00:52:25,320 --> 00:52:28,040
will I stop that happening?
Will I say I have my period?

970
00:52:28,040 --> 00:52:30,040
Will I say, you know what I
mean?

971
00:52:30,040 --> 00:52:34,760
And so it's, it's like always a
thing you've had to deal with.

972
00:52:34,760 --> 00:52:37,680
And it's normalized, though.
Well, if you're making out with

973
00:52:37,680 --> 00:52:40,000
them, then that's what you
should be doing.

974
00:52:40,000 --> 00:52:43,080
Clearly you consented to having
sex, but that is not true.

975
00:52:43,280 --> 00:52:46,840
Those are two different things.
And yeah, I want to dig into

976
00:52:46,840 --> 00:52:50,800
that a little more because you
were searching and I've done it

977
00:52:50,800 --> 00:52:56,080
too, for like a reason that a
man is going to accept, right to

978
00:52:56,440 --> 00:52:59,280
to stop pressuring you for sex,
essentially, right.

979
00:52:59,280 --> 00:53:01,960
And so you're like, oh, like,
I'm on my period.

980
00:53:01,960 --> 00:53:04,840
But like saying I don't want to
isn't a valid enough answer.

981
00:53:04,920 --> 00:53:07,320
They will argue with you, or at
least some men will argue with

982
00:53:07,320 --> 00:53:08,640
you.
They'll continue to try to push

983
00:53:08,640 --> 00:53:12,240
your boundaries.
Actually a similar sort of

984
00:53:12,240 --> 00:53:15,280
situation, like there's a reason
a lot of women to sort of

985
00:53:15,280 --> 00:53:18,080
discourage in advance they're
not interested in will say I'm

986
00:53:18,080 --> 00:53:19,640
married or I have a boyfriend,
right?

987
00:53:19,640 --> 00:53:21,480
And again, that's patriarchy,
right?

988
00:53:21,480 --> 00:53:23,640
That's saying I'm already the
property of a man.

989
00:53:23,920 --> 00:53:26,960
And so men are more likely to
respect that because they're.

990
00:53:26,960 --> 00:53:29,760
Respecting the man they don't
know exactly that doesn't.

991
00:53:29,760 --> 00:53:33,360
Exist rather than respecting.
I don't want to do that with

992
00:53:33,360 --> 00:53:34,520
you.
Yeah.

993
00:53:34,520 --> 00:53:37,480
I mean, saying I don't want to,
that's an invitation for a lot

994
00:53:37,480 --> 00:53:39,880
of men to keep pushing, keep
pushing boundaries, right?

995
00:53:41,480 --> 00:53:44,080
But if you're like, oh, I
already belong to another man,

996
00:53:44,080 --> 00:53:45,680
they're more likely to step back
now.

997
00:53:45,680 --> 00:53:47,680
Not always.
Sometimes they'll be like, well,

998
00:53:47,680 --> 00:53:50,000
he's not here right now or like,
I don't believe you or like

999
00:53:50,000 --> 00:53:52,000
whatever.
So sometimes, like you'll get

1000
00:53:52,000 --> 00:53:56,080
that pushing that continues, but
that is often your best

1001
00:53:56,080 --> 00:53:57,200
strategy.
Yeah.

1002
00:53:57,200 --> 00:54:03,240
And the fact that we have known
this from being a young girl,

1003
00:54:03,800 --> 00:54:08,080
young woman, basically that, you
know, again, I don't remember

1004
00:54:08,080 --> 00:54:12,240
anybody sitting me dying and
giving me these strategies, but

1005
00:54:12,240 --> 00:54:17,480
you just absorb them and know
that you will have to use them.

1006
00:54:17,800 --> 00:54:21,680
I remember reading some book as
a teen and I like they

1007
00:54:21,680 --> 00:54:23,880
encouraged teen girls to read
it.

1008
00:54:23,880 --> 00:54:27,800
It was something about like if a
guy is making advances, you say

1009
00:54:27,800 --> 00:54:29,080
you want to go and get a
hamburger.

1010
00:54:29,080 --> 00:54:30,640
Do you remember that?
Book I do not.

1011
00:54:30,760 --> 00:54:33,320
It was like titled something
along the same lines.

1012
00:54:33,320 --> 00:54:38,400
But in hindsight, again, it's
like teaching, you know, is not

1013
00:54:38,400 --> 00:54:40,320
enough.
Well, because a lot of times

1014
00:54:40,320 --> 00:54:42,480
it's not right.
You have to come up with a story

1015
00:54:42,480 --> 00:54:45,480
and like, whether the person
writing this book was doing this

1016
00:54:45,520 --> 00:54:48,240
as a girl, it's not going to
work.

1017
00:54:48,240 --> 00:54:51,920
So you better get creative or,
you know, let's just make up a

1018
00:54:51,920 --> 00:54:53,680
little story.
I mean, what the hell?

1019
00:54:53,680 --> 00:54:56,640
Like this is insane is.
The point of the hamburger To

1020
00:54:56,640 --> 00:54:59,360
get to a public place where then
you could potentially escape.

1021
00:54:59,360 --> 00:55:03,240
And a distraction, OK.
I mean, you know the number of

1022
00:55:03,240 --> 00:55:07,400
times I've been asked by a male
Uber driver, like, do you have a

1023
00:55:07,400 --> 00:55:08,360
boyfriend?
Wow.

1024
00:55:08,640 --> 00:55:11,200
Are you here alone?
Where are you going?

1025
00:55:11,200 --> 00:55:12,880
Like, especially when you're
getting picked up from the

1026
00:55:12,880 --> 00:55:16,000
airport or something like that.
And I think most of us, as women

1027
00:55:16,000 --> 00:55:19,400
know the answer instinctively is
always yes, I have a boyfriend.

1028
00:55:19,560 --> 00:55:21,080
No, I'm not here alone.
Yep.

1029
00:55:21,120 --> 00:55:23,080
Yes, I'm going to meet my
boyfriend right now.

1030
00:55:23,560 --> 00:55:28,120
Even to the point where you will
fake phone call. 100% definitely

1031
00:55:28,120 --> 00:55:29,320
faked phone call.
Yep.

1032
00:55:29,560 --> 00:55:33,400
And there are actually some men
on the Internet who on like

1033
00:55:33,400 --> 00:55:36,680
Instagram and stuff will provide
you with a script, yes, where

1034
00:55:36,680 --> 00:55:40,440
you can put it on speaker and
you can practice the timing.

1035
00:55:40,440 --> 00:55:42,560
I mean what?
Why?

1036
00:55:42,720 --> 00:55:45,840
What?
Like like why is this necessary?

1037
00:55:45,840 --> 00:55:47,280
You.
Have to live in this survival

1038
00:55:47,280 --> 00:55:52,080
mode and you're so right.
I have had I had an Uber driver

1039
00:55:52,080 --> 00:55:57,800
once who was randomly taking me
to my own graduation up at the

1040
00:55:57,800 --> 00:56:01,800
UI was going up, you know, early
my people were coming up after

1041
00:56:02,320 --> 00:56:07,720
and on hindsight was asking me
very specific questions that

1042
00:56:07,720 --> 00:56:11,080
didn't seem ominous.
And by the time I got home from

1043
00:56:11,080 --> 00:56:15,480
my graduation ceremony that day,
I had an e-mail in my work

1044
00:56:15,480 --> 00:56:18,720
e-mail what and he's like, well,
you know, I just asked a couple

1045
00:56:18,720 --> 00:56:23,000
of questions by where he worked
and looked you up and he

1046
00:56:23,000 --> 00:56:26,960
actually used the phrase maybe
you might be repulsed by me, but

1047
00:56:26,960 --> 00:56:28,960
I would I would like to take you
out.

1048
00:56:28,960 --> 00:56:32,200
I would like to do this and I
was just like that's terrifying.

1049
00:56:32,240 --> 00:56:39,400
You're literally just going in
an Uber, like a 10 minute drive.

1050
00:56:39,800 --> 00:56:42,200
I was mostly on my phone because
I was like coordinating with

1051
00:56:42,200 --> 00:56:46,240
people through text and it's
like I can't even do small talk.

1052
00:56:46,560 --> 00:56:50,680
This also happened to me on a
ski lift one time, which I still

1053
00:56:50,840 --> 00:56:55,000
marvel at because literally all
that were visible was a little

1054
00:56:55,000 --> 00:56:59,680
bit of my nose and my eyes
because I had a Gator on, on a

1055
00:56:59,680 --> 00:57:03,280
helmet and ski goggles, which I
think I had put the goggles up,

1056
00:57:03,320 --> 00:57:07,440
you know, on top of my helmet
and had like a couple of minute

1057
00:57:07,800 --> 00:57:10,360
chatter, which I thought was
very pleasant.

1058
00:57:10,360 --> 00:57:13,680
You often do on the.
Lift again, another work e-mail.

1059
00:57:13,760 --> 00:57:16,240
I will never share where I work.
Yeah.

1060
00:57:16,400 --> 00:57:19,560
I won't even put my job on a
dating profile, like, because

1061
00:57:19,840 --> 00:57:24,160
I've also had people say, oh, I
swiped on you, but you didn't

1062
00:57:24,160 --> 00:57:27,200
swipe on me.
But so I looked up, you know,

1063
00:57:27,360 --> 00:57:30,480
Irish professor, whatever.
I mean, everybody knows now.

1064
00:57:31,560 --> 00:57:35,080
You know what, I totally get why
that with the interwebs you can

1065
00:57:35,080 --> 00:57:38,240
find anybody totally get all
that, but it's like you can't

1066
00:57:38,240 --> 00:57:40,640
even have small talk because
it's entrapment.

1067
00:57:40,880 --> 00:57:43,680
Yeah, well, that's why I've put
on my Uber profile.

1068
00:57:43,680 --> 00:57:46,840
No conversation like silence.
But they don't always respect

1069
00:57:46,840 --> 00:57:49,640
that either, right?
But I'm just like, I prefer not

1070
00:57:49,640 --> 00:57:52,400
to talk.
It's just wild like it.

1071
00:57:52,880 --> 00:57:56,200
So for the men that say they
don't know, let us tell you

1072
00:57:56,200 --> 00:58:02,120
this.
Imagine living like you are in

1073
00:58:02,120 --> 00:58:05,360
the fucking Hunger Games or
something all the time, right?

1074
00:58:05,360 --> 00:58:08,120
That it's always a bite
survival.

1075
00:58:08,640 --> 00:58:14,400
It's always about, you know,
strategies Like do you consider

1076
00:58:14,640 --> 00:58:17,280
that you just call an Uber and
go?

1077
00:58:17,880 --> 00:58:22,240
Do you consider that you can go
on a date?

1078
00:58:22,240 --> 00:58:24,880
And I'm not saying things don't
happen to men, but you know.

1079
00:58:25,640 --> 00:58:27,200
Well, can I stop you right
there?

1080
00:58:27,200 --> 00:58:29,560
Actually, with things don't have
it because I feel like this is

1081
00:58:29,560 --> 00:58:33,200
something that men will
sometimes say as a deflection.

1082
00:58:33,200 --> 00:58:34,800
OK, this, this.
What about ISM?

1083
00:58:34,800 --> 00:58:37,280
Well, what about men who are
raped and men who are sexually

1084
00:58:37,280 --> 00:58:40,240
assaulted?
And to be really clear, yes,

1085
00:58:40,400 --> 00:58:42,640
that does happen.
And yes, we condemn that.

1086
00:58:42,800 --> 00:58:48,040
Of course, all right, but at
least in this country, 91% of

1087
00:58:48,040 --> 00:58:52,040
rape and sexual assault victims
are female and 9% are male, and

1088
00:58:52,040 --> 00:58:54,840
over 99% of perpetrators are
male.

1089
00:58:55,040 --> 00:58:57,720
OK, so fucking stop it with the
what about ISM?

1090
00:58:58,000 --> 00:58:59,280
Like fucking stop it.
It's.

1091
00:58:59,320 --> 00:59:02,600
Men on men clearly most of the.
Time well, and mostly

1092
00:59:02,720 --> 00:59:05,800
unfortunately it's men on male
children and teenagers and and

1093
00:59:05,800 --> 00:59:07,880
very young men.
OK, so that happens too.

1094
00:59:07,880 --> 00:59:10,560
Yes, men do get raped.
It's usually.

1095
00:59:10,800 --> 00:59:14,080
By a man.
Children or near children.

1096
00:59:14,160 --> 00:59:17,240
And it's it's by a man almost
always, 1% of the time we're

1097
00:59:17,240 --> 00:59:19,760
talking about a female
perpetrator, at least by the

1098
00:59:19,760 --> 00:59:21,240
stats.
Wow.

1099
00:59:21,400 --> 00:59:22,760
Yeah.
Cut it the fuck out.

1100
00:59:22,760 --> 00:59:24,120
Yeah, so.
Fucking stop it.

1101
00:59:24,160 --> 00:59:26,480
Yes, that exists.
Yes, we don't like it.

1102
00:59:26,480 --> 00:59:29,640
Yeah, but like, it's not in it.
Like that is a false equivalency

1103
00:59:29,640 --> 00:59:30,600
to bring that.
Up.

1104
00:59:30,600 --> 00:59:32,400
Yeah, OK.
I mean, it's not even.

1105
00:59:32,520 --> 00:59:34,240
Yeah, close.
And once again, the men that are

1106
00:59:34,240 --> 00:59:36,760
raped are mostly very young, if
not children.

1107
00:59:36,800 --> 00:59:40,520
So not men, just male children.
Yeah, so stop it.

1108
00:59:41,160 --> 00:59:45,240
Yeah, that's the simple answer.
One of the other approaches

1109
00:59:45,240 --> 00:59:49,600
that's often presented as an
option, which really, really

1110
00:59:49,600 --> 00:59:54,760
pisses me off, is mothers, teach
your sons you know not to.

1111
00:59:55,000 --> 00:59:57,680
Not to I mean.
Yeah, sure, you should do that.

1112
00:59:57,680 --> 01:00:00,320
But like, obviously that's not
solving the problem.

1113
01:00:00,440 --> 01:00:03,320
Well, and also there's an
inference there that previously

1114
01:00:03,320 --> 01:00:05,480
mothers were not teaching their
sons.

1115
01:00:05,600 --> 01:00:08,160
Yeah, once again, women, it's
all your fault, right?

1116
01:00:08,200 --> 01:00:10,960
You didn't teach your sons that
raping was bad, right?

1117
01:00:11,200 --> 01:00:14,920
They should fucking know that.
Yes, and it's, you know, you.

1118
01:00:15,080 --> 01:00:19,080
You for the most part, people
are raising their children to be

1119
01:00:19,080 --> 01:00:24,520
good humans, to respect people
to, you know, stay in your lane.

1120
01:00:24,520 --> 01:00:27,000
Don't don't be taking things
that don't belong to you.

1121
01:00:27,080 --> 01:00:30,640
And but all of a sudden, as you
say, it's just another way to

1122
01:00:30,640 --> 01:00:33,640
blame women for this happening.
Yes, it's another way your son's

1123
01:00:33,640 --> 01:00:34,880
better.
Yeah, that's right.

1124
01:00:34,880 --> 01:00:37,240
Another way to to blame women.
Wow.

1125
01:00:38,120 --> 01:00:39,920
Yeah, Yeah.
Disgusting.

1126
01:00:40,040 --> 01:00:44,480
Incredible.
Yeah, so, so, So what, You know,

1127
01:00:44,560 --> 01:00:47,360
maybe I just need to feel like
there's some kind of a solution

1128
01:00:47,360 --> 01:00:49,200
right there.
But you know.

1129
01:00:49,320 --> 01:00:52,000
I mean, I think we're doing what
we can by way of education.

1130
01:00:52,000 --> 01:00:55,280
So like here's another thing
that, you know, perpetrates it

1131
01:00:55,440 --> 01:00:57,760
like you already mentioned, is
these men with their heads in

1132
01:00:57,760 --> 01:01:02,800
the sand that are shocked, I say
shocked to hear that anyone

1133
01:01:02,960 --> 01:01:05,560
whatever sexually assaults a
woman like.

1134
01:01:06,360 --> 01:01:07,800
Fuck you dude.
I'm sorry.

1135
01:01:07,880 --> 01:01:10,680
Like no.
Literally, though, I mean, that

1136
01:01:10,680 --> 01:01:13,880
level of naivete is just
unbelievable to me.

1137
01:01:13,880 --> 01:01:16,000
Like you, have you ever listened
to a woman ever?

1138
01:01:16,000 --> 01:01:19,280
Have you ever, like, have you
ever opened up the Internet,

1139
01:01:19,280 --> 01:01:21,000
right?
Have you read a news article

1140
01:01:21,000 --> 01:01:23,680
from time to time?
Because this isn't hidden.

1141
01:01:23,680 --> 01:01:25,160
Like this is out there all the
time.

1142
01:01:25,560 --> 01:01:27,880
Like have you consumed media?
Right?

1143
01:01:28,000 --> 01:01:31,280
Like do.
You have a mother, sister.

1144
01:01:31,360 --> 01:01:35,240
God, a female friend, right?
You know, I mean, have you even

1145
01:01:35,240 --> 01:01:39,120
watched like like the sort of
gritty like TV shows, right?

1146
01:01:39,120 --> 01:01:42,080
Violence against women real
common in this real common,

1147
01:01:42,080 --> 01:01:44,280
right?
Have you consumed porn?

1148
01:01:44,280 --> 01:01:47,080
And I'm not saying that
pornography is necessarily bad.

1149
01:01:47,080 --> 01:01:50,040
I myself enjoy some porn from
time to time, but there is a

1150
01:01:50,040 --> 01:01:53,760
strain of it that is incredibly
violent towards women and it's

1151
01:01:53,760 --> 01:01:55,600
problematic and it's pretty
pervasive.

1152
01:01:55,920 --> 01:01:59,080
And I would also throw into
their all the quote barely legal

1153
01:01:59,080 --> 01:02:02,640
shit.
Yes, well, and also just the

1154
01:02:02,640 --> 01:02:06,360
fact, again, a no judgement if
if people like it or they've

1155
01:02:06,360 --> 01:02:08,000
done it.
That's not what I'm saying.

1156
01:02:08,000 --> 01:02:13,240
But when you even consider a lot
of actions that are displayed in

1157
01:02:13,240 --> 01:02:16,200
porn or even sexual
relationships, a lot of it is

1158
01:02:16,200 --> 01:02:18,160
centered on harm to the woman.
Yeah.

1159
01:02:18,160 --> 01:02:22,120
Not, not the man.
Like, you know, not put your

1160
01:02:22,120 --> 01:02:24,960
hand around the throat of a man
doesn't come up nearly as

1161
01:02:24,960 --> 01:02:27,960
frequently as.
And again, no judgement if

1162
01:02:27,960 --> 01:02:30,680
that's your thing.
You enjoy the moment, but it's

1163
01:02:30,680 --> 01:02:35,160
this cultural idea that those
things are hot.

1164
01:02:35,360 --> 01:02:36,200
Yeah, right.
Like.

1165
01:02:36,440 --> 01:02:40,480
You should want to get slapped.
You should want to have be

1166
01:02:40,480 --> 01:02:42,000
choked.
You should want to be.

1167
01:02:42,240 --> 01:02:45,760
And again, no judgment.
But why is it always against

1168
01:02:45,760 --> 01:02:48,560
women?
Yes, some people do actually,

1169
01:02:48,680 --> 01:02:50,160
you know, legitimately enjoy
that.

1170
01:02:50,160 --> 01:02:53,760
And no shade if that is a
consensual safe thing that you

1171
01:02:53,760 --> 01:02:56,320
are doing.
Emphasis on the consensual but

1172
01:02:56,400 --> 01:02:58,840
But why is it always against the
woman?

1173
01:02:58,880 --> 01:03:00,800
Yeah.
Why is it not a hot thing out

1174
01:03:00,800 --> 01:03:04,080
there to slap a man's?
Well, there is actually that, I

1175
01:03:04,080 --> 01:03:07,520
mean, I can if, if you'd like,
we can, we can peruse some of

1176
01:03:07,520 --> 01:03:11,480
that later, but it is a
pervasive, it is much rarer,

1177
01:03:11,480 --> 01:03:15,800
yes, compared to the violence
against women style of porn.

1178
01:03:15,840 --> 01:03:22,160
So, yeah, that's another one you
see in the just not pornography,

1179
01:03:22,160 --> 01:03:25,000
but in the regular media as
well.

1180
01:03:25,000 --> 01:03:26,440
Violence against children,
right.

1181
01:03:27,880 --> 01:03:29,120
That's another thing that
happens.

1182
01:03:29,400 --> 01:03:32,440
Yeah, same thing.
Another thing that you'll sort

1183
01:03:32,440 --> 01:03:36,200
of hear a lot is, is men are
like, oh, yeah, but women can

1184
01:03:36,200 --> 01:03:37,640
make it up.
There are false reports.

1185
01:03:37,840 --> 01:03:41,400
Now, it's true that there are.
As far as we can tell, this is

1186
01:03:41,400 --> 01:03:44,280
very rare, OK?
Like 2% of the time is 1

1187
01:03:44,280 --> 01:03:46,160
statistic.
These are hard statistics to

1188
01:03:46,160 --> 01:03:48,440
come by, right?
Does that happen?

1189
01:03:48,440 --> 01:03:50,720
Yes.
Is that the vast, vast, vast

1190
01:03:50,720 --> 01:03:53,120
majority of reports?
Absolutely not.

1191
01:03:53,120 --> 01:03:56,200
OK, most of the time it's the
woman's telling the truth.

1192
01:03:56,400 --> 01:04:00,280
Well, and you could argue like I
would love to know the stats in

1193
01:04:00,280 --> 01:04:06,080
the other direction of people
not reporting or people that are

1194
01:04:06,080 --> 01:04:09,840
reporting.
I reported a sexual harassment

1195
01:04:10,520 --> 01:04:16,480
incident three times before it
was even taken seriously.

1196
01:04:16,480 --> 01:04:21,080
And it was only starting to be
taken seriously because the

1197
01:04:21,080 --> 01:04:25,400
person I was reporting it to
realize that they could get into

1198
01:04:25,400 --> 01:04:30,240
trouble because they laughed and
made jokes about our height

1199
01:04:30,240 --> 01:04:32,480
difference on the 1st 2 rounds
of me reporting it.

1200
01:04:32,480 --> 01:04:33,880
Holy shit.
Yeah.

1201
01:04:34,120 --> 01:04:37,240
And so it was sort of
self-interest, interest that was

1202
01:04:37,240 --> 01:04:41,040
taken in the case.
So like that was for arguably

1203
01:04:41,040 --> 01:04:44,560
not a fun experience, but
something a lot more minor than

1204
01:04:44,720 --> 01:04:49,320
a full on assault, rape, or like
drugging your wife and putting

1205
01:04:49,320 --> 01:04:52,200
it on the Internet.
Still not OK, still on the same

1206
01:04:52,200 --> 01:04:54,520
spectrum of violence against
women mentality.

1207
01:04:54,880 --> 01:04:57,840
Of this idea of like, well, what
is the big deal?

1208
01:04:58,840 --> 01:05:02,000
You should be fine to be touched
when you said you don't want to

1209
01:05:02,000 --> 01:05:05,880
be touched or you should be, you
know, like what?

1210
01:05:06,560 --> 01:05:09,280
Yeah, or to have inappropriate
comments directed at you.

1211
01:05:09,360 --> 01:05:12,960
Yeah, so when you're telling me
that will sometimes women make

1212
01:05:12,960 --> 01:05:14,560
it up.
OK, cool.

1213
01:05:14,560 --> 01:05:17,720
And.
Yeah, more often.

1214
01:05:17,920 --> 01:05:19,200
Yes.
They're not believed.

1215
01:05:19,280 --> 01:05:21,040
They are not believed.
Yeah.

1216
01:05:21,240 --> 01:05:23,880
And you just see this over and
over.

1217
01:05:23,880 --> 01:05:28,800
And also we will never know the
instances that are not reported

1218
01:05:29,000 --> 01:05:31,960
and apparently not we don't even
know happened.

1219
01:05:32,240 --> 01:05:34,520
Yeah, because you're
unconscious.

1220
01:05:34,560 --> 01:05:37,080
Horrible.
So yeah, that's a bullshit

1221
01:05:37,080 --> 01:05:39,960
argument, like another false
equivalency.

1222
01:05:39,960 --> 01:05:42,360
Yeah, that's another false
equivalency.

1223
01:05:42,440 --> 01:05:45,240
Yep.
Let's see, I would also say that

1224
01:05:46,000 --> 01:05:48,560
slut shaming women, that's
another tactic, right?

1225
01:05:48,560 --> 01:05:51,760
Because that kind of plays into
the clearly she was asking for

1226
01:05:51,760 --> 01:05:53,440
it.
Yeah, strand of things, right?

1227
01:05:53,640 --> 01:05:54,800
Yeah, we're not doing that
anymore.

1228
01:05:54,880 --> 01:05:57,800
Yeah, no.
No, please stop.

1229
01:05:58,280 --> 01:06:00,160
Please stop.
Right.

1230
01:06:00,360 --> 01:06:03,560
But somehow that's never, like,
sort of levelled against men,

1231
01:06:03,600 --> 01:06:04,800
right?
If they sleep around.

1232
01:06:04,800 --> 01:06:05,960
Oh, awesome.
Right.

1233
01:06:05,960 --> 01:06:08,920
Like, what a cool guy.
Like, he gets all this, like,

1234
01:06:09,000 --> 01:06:10,960
pussy.
Yeah.

1235
01:06:11,000 --> 01:06:13,040
But if a woman sleeps around,
well, what a slut.

1236
01:06:13,040 --> 01:06:17,240
And then if she is assaulted
like that, lack of belief is

1237
01:06:17,240 --> 01:06:20,280
there too.
Yeah, it's just embedded into

1238
01:06:20,280 --> 01:06:22,840
it.
And if you even consider

1239
01:06:23,320 --> 01:06:28,400
language and you know that a man
is often referred to as this

1240
01:06:29,120 --> 01:06:32,240
large horse.
Like a stud.

1241
01:06:33,360 --> 01:06:37,960
And yet a woman is a a slut and
you even have to preface slut

1242
01:06:37,960 --> 01:06:41,720
with manslaught or because it's
inherently feminine.

1243
01:06:42,080 --> 01:06:43,840
Yeah.
And so it's embedded into our

1244
01:06:43,840 --> 01:06:46,640
very language.
It is at A at a very like

1245
01:06:46,640 --> 01:06:51,280
fundamental language as our
insults from a very young age,

1246
01:06:51,280 --> 01:06:55,640
boys being told don't cry like a
little girl or Yep, you're

1247
01:06:55,640 --> 01:06:59,960
acting like a little girl like
it's so you know, embedding this

1248
01:06:59,960 --> 01:07:02,320
idea in children that bad.
Right.

1249
01:07:02,320 --> 01:07:04,640
That women are inferior.
Yeah, yeah.

1250
01:07:04,680 --> 01:07:06,200
Being like a girl is.
Bad right?

1251
01:07:06,200 --> 01:07:11,680
So you gotta like bro up right?
Like bro out something and act

1252
01:07:11,680 --> 01:07:14,080
more like a man.
And part of that includes

1253
01:07:14,240 --> 01:07:16,920
derogatory comments or actions
towards women.

1254
01:07:16,920 --> 01:07:20,480
Yeah.
And I think busting the myth, as

1255
01:07:20,480 --> 01:07:25,320
you mentioned as well that you
know, but it's just natural men,

1256
01:07:25,320 --> 01:07:28,640
they want sex and women don't
want it as much, which if you

1257
01:07:28,640 --> 01:07:32,920
just look at the way bodies are
designed, right?

1258
01:07:32,960 --> 01:07:37,120
Like, OK, well then you know,
why can't a man for the most

1259
01:07:37,120 --> 01:07:39,600
part just have one orgasm,
right?

1260
01:07:39,600 --> 01:07:42,560
Why do women have a built in
that we can have multiple whole

1261
01:07:42,560 --> 01:07:47,560
lot like it doesn't From a quote
UN quote nature perspective that

1262
01:07:47,560 --> 01:07:50,560
argument doesn't even hold.
Yeah, no, definitely not.

1263
01:07:50,560 --> 01:07:53,600
And sometimes people will point
to like, oh, well, it's easy to

1264
01:07:53,600 --> 01:07:57,000
get a man to hook up, but it's
hard to get a woman to hook up.

1265
01:07:57,000 --> 01:07:59,680
And like the conclusion they're
drawing is a women just don't

1266
01:07:59,680 --> 01:08:01,520
want sex or they don't want
casual sex.

1267
01:08:01,880 --> 01:08:05,040
I would say that is not true.
I would like to have sex.

1268
01:08:05,040 --> 01:08:06,720
I'd like to have casual sex.
That sounds great.

1269
01:08:06,720 --> 01:08:08,760
That sounds fantastic.
But when you have to do all the

1270
01:08:08,760 --> 01:08:11,680
calculus around your safety,
well, kind of.

1271
01:08:11,680 --> 01:08:12,800
Turn off.
It's a little.

1272
01:08:12,800 --> 01:08:15,600
Risk benefit situation, right?
And you're like, well, what

1273
01:08:15,600 --> 01:08:19,240
risks am I taking for, you know,
this hook up exactly?

1274
01:08:19,359 --> 01:08:23,080
Lot of times I'm sorry, it's
just not worth it. 100% I think

1275
01:08:23,160 --> 01:08:27,479
that is so good to mention that
and spell it out real.

1276
01:08:27,479 --> 01:08:28,560
Clear.
Real clear.

1277
01:08:28,560 --> 01:08:31,640
For men who complain.
Good men, nice guys.

1278
01:08:31,840 --> 01:08:35,279
Who could say Yeah.
That Oh yeah, my wife doesn't

1279
01:08:35,279 --> 01:08:38,040
put out as often as I'd like or
my girlfriend doesn't want to

1280
01:08:38,120 --> 01:08:40,080
have sex, Sir.
Why?

1281
01:08:40,600 --> 01:08:42,359
Yeah.
Why could that be?

1282
01:08:42,439 --> 01:08:46,080
Like it's not because she has a
low sex drive, I can guarantee.

1283
01:08:46,080 --> 01:08:49,479
That's probably some.
People do medication things,

1284
01:08:49,479 --> 01:08:52,920
yeah, hormones and.
Some men do too though.

1285
01:08:53,080 --> 01:08:55,240
Yes, I've had that mismatch
before.

1286
01:08:55,240 --> 01:09:00,160
Yeah, it's just not a a decisive
conclusion you can draw by all

1287
01:09:00,160 --> 01:09:02,240
of humanity.
I just feel like those are men

1288
01:09:02,240 --> 01:09:04,399
telling on themselves.
Yeah, you're like, what a cute

1289
01:09:04,399 --> 01:09:09,600
way to say I'm not good at sex.
Did someone say Ben Shapiro?

1290
01:09:09,640 --> 01:09:13,960
I know, yeah.
Getting wet isn't natural.

1291
01:09:14,279 --> 01:09:17,880
My wife never gets wet.
Oh, Ben Shapiro.

1292
01:09:18,000 --> 01:09:20,600
Oh dear, Oh dear, dear, dear.
Yeah.

1293
01:09:20,880 --> 01:09:23,600
It's that weird tweet that he
deleted too about fantasizing

1294
01:09:23,600 --> 01:09:25,040
about having sex with his
sister.

1295
01:09:25,359 --> 01:09:27,000
What?
I'll have to dig that one up.

1296
01:09:27,000 --> 01:09:30,080
I can't remember the exact
words, but I know there are.

1297
01:09:30,120 --> 01:09:32,399
Multiple layers.
There problematic little man.

1298
01:09:32,520 --> 01:09:35,160
Wow.
Yeah, his wife doesn't get wet,

1299
01:09:35,160 --> 01:09:36,880
but he sure hopes his sister
does.

1300
01:09:38,080 --> 01:09:40,479
That's not natural.
That's yeah.

1301
01:09:40,479 --> 01:09:43,479
If we want to talk about
natural, you know, it's just

1302
01:09:43,479 --> 01:09:46,960
amazing the amount of things
that are put out there as.

1303
01:09:47,200 --> 01:09:49,680
Natural.
Yeah, it really is.

1304
01:09:50,000 --> 01:09:54,120
Like, no, yeah, no, thank you.
Yeah.

1305
01:09:54,480 --> 01:09:58,280
So I don't know.
I think we've said a lot of

1306
01:09:58,280 --> 01:10:00,240
things.
There's a lot more I think that

1307
01:10:00,240 --> 01:10:04,120
we could say.
I think it really upsets me when

1308
01:10:04,120 --> 01:10:08,080
men have this attitude that
violence against women is kind

1309
01:10:08,080 --> 01:10:09,760
of something that doesn't have
anything to do with them.

1310
01:10:10,040 --> 01:10:14,440
Yes, because again, you know,
what we're trying to do here to

1311
01:10:14,880 --> 01:10:20,560
Mr. Nice Guys talking to you as
well is, you know, maybe when

1312
01:10:20,560 --> 01:10:22,520
you're talking to your friend,
that's a woman.

1313
01:10:22,560 --> 01:10:24,400
Why are you touching her all the
time?

1314
01:10:24,600 --> 01:10:27,040
Oh yeah, stop.
That that's actually really

1315
01:10:27,040 --> 01:10:31,280
pervasive.
That happens a lot yeah and I

1316
01:10:31,280 --> 01:10:35,320
honestly, a lot of times I don't
even say anything when men are

1317
01:10:35,320 --> 01:10:37,280
touching me.
Yeah, yeah, no cuz I'm like

1318
01:10:37,280 --> 01:10:39,760
okay, whatever.
Well, because you'll be called,

1319
01:10:40,000 --> 01:10:43,760
you're overreacting, you just
don't like them, blah blah blah.

1320
01:10:43,800 --> 01:10:45,960
I'm not touching you that much.
I just, I didn't do that.

1321
01:10:46,800 --> 01:10:49,440
Yeah, no.
And so maybe stop.

1322
01:10:49,720 --> 01:10:52,080
Yeah, stop it.
That's a simple thing that you

1323
01:10:52,080 --> 01:10:54,080
can do today.
Stops.

1324
01:10:54,880 --> 01:10:58,280
You don't need to rub her arm or
keep reaching.

1325
01:10:58,280 --> 01:11:00,800
Out or her bad times?
Yeah, exactly.

1326
01:11:00,840 --> 01:11:01,720
Stop.
Yeah.

1327
01:11:01,840 --> 01:11:05,400
Just don't.
Yeah, keep your hands in your

1328
01:11:05,400 --> 01:11:07,480
pockets.
Yeah, if you need to keep.

1329
01:11:07,480 --> 01:11:09,560
Them somewhere else.
Just just do it.

1330
01:11:09,600 --> 01:11:11,760
And you know what men, if you're
right, they're still saying,

1331
01:11:11,760 --> 01:11:14,520
well, I, I, I had no idea.
Ask.

1332
01:11:15,040 --> 01:11:20,120
Yeah, that's true consent.
Yes, like and also ask the women

1333
01:11:20,120 --> 01:11:24,320
in your life do is does this,
has this happened?

1334
01:11:24,320 --> 01:11:28,000
Like, you know, maybe tread
lightly, don't quit triggering

1335
01:11:28,000 --> 01:11:31,960
the shit out of people, but you
know, like tell me your

1336
01:11:31,960 --> 01:11:34,440
experiences.
Maybe, you know, maybe this is

1337
01:11:34,440 --> 01:11:37,320
another reason why men should
ask more questions generally.

1338
01:11:37,320 --> 01:11:41,040
Yeah, I think that's the reason
I think that you don't

1339
01:11:41,040 --> 01:11:44,680
necessarily want to ask your
female friends to do a whole

1340
01:11:44,680 --> 01:11:47,600
bunch of work, like, in the same
way that you don't want to go

1341
01:11:47,600 --> 01:11:50,640
to, you know, a member of an
ethnic or racial minority and

1342
01:11:50,640 --> 01:11:52,280
put the whole burden on them to
educate you.

1343
01:11:52,280 --> 01:11:53,880
Of course, you can go to the
fucking Internet.

1344
01:11:53,960 --> 01:11:55,520
Like, you can look some shit up
on your own.

1345
01:11:55,680 --> 01:11:56,720
Yeah.
Like, you can still ask

1346
01:11:56,720 --> 01:11:58,840
questions but, like, show
interest, right.

1347
01:11:58,840 --> 01:12:00,840
But you don't have to be like,
oh, hey, like.

1348
01:12:01,040 --> 01:12:03,120
Tell me.
Please explain this whole thing

1349
01:12:03,120 --> 01:12:05,400
to me.
List your traumas so that I can

1350
01:12:05,400 --> 01:12:08,880
be a better man.
Yeah, look at me doing the work.

1351
01:12:08,880 --> 01:12:10,480
Oh.
My God, yeah.

1352
01:12:10,720 --> 01:12:14,800
I mean, women do that too in
that other situation, you know,

1353
01:12:14,880 --> 01:12:18,640
but but yeah, like maybe look a
thing up now and then.

1354
01:12:18,640 --> 01:12:22,200
Yes, and do do your own
research.

1355
01:12:23,040 --> 01:12:25,280
That's a fairpoint.
Like don't, don't put it on the

1356
01:12:25,280 --> 01:12:30,200
victimized and you know, re
victimized and I mean, women

1357
01:12:30,200 --> 01:12:32,080
have a role to play in this.
Too right?

1358
01:12:32,200 --> 01:12:35,760
Absolutely.
You know, don't protect the

1359
01:12:35,760 --> 01:12:39,600
shitty men in your life either.
Your brothers, your your

1360
01:12:39,600 --> 01:12:42,840
relatives.
Again, some personal experience

1361
01:12:42,840 --> 01:12:47,200
there of a a woman I know who's
always posting believe women,

1362
01:12:47,200 --> 01:12:51,920
believe women and yet and yet
will protect her brother to the

1363
01:12:51,920 --> 01:12:53,480
NTH degree.
Right.

1364
01:12:53,480 --> 01:12:56,240
And this is a person that has
multiple allegations against

1365
01:12:56,240 --> 01:12:57,840
him, right?
I mean, we're not just talking

1366
01:12:57,840 --> 01:13:03,160
about a one off here multiple.
And also, I would argue she

1367
01:13:03,160 --> 01:13:06,520
knows in her heart of hearts
have, you know, they've they've

1368
01:13:06,520 --> 01:13:08,520
seen the aftermath, shall we
say.

1369
01:13:08,520 --> 01:13:14,000
And so, yeah, that the the bro
code can also extend to women

1370
01:13:14,000 --> 01:13:17,520
mothers protecting sons, you
know, people protecting

1371
01:13:17,520 --> 01:13:21,040
siblings.
Like, no, no, that's true.

1372
01:13:21,320 --> 01:13:25,560
Just no.
Yeah, Yeah.

1373
01:13:25,560 --> 01:13:28,840
I guess I would just say like
kind of wake up, right?

1374
01:13:28,840 --> 01:13:30,680
Like this is a pervasive
problem.

1375
01:13:31,920 --> 01:13:35,400
And it starts small.
It starts with those tiny

1376
01:13:35,400 --> 01:13:37,280
entitlements.
It starts with those.

1377
01:13:37,360 --> 01:13:40,200
The little touches, the little
comments, gendered and all the

1378
01:13:40,200 --> 01:13:41,280
stuff.
Yep.

1379
01:13:41,440 --> 01:13:46,080
Yep, all of the things.
And so, you know, we can start

1380
01:13:46,080 --> 01:13:51,160
small and all, all do our part.
Yeah.

1381
01:13:51,200 --> 01:13:52,840
Please make the world a better
place.

1382
01:13:52,840 --> 01:13:55,200
Absolutely.
Please make rape academies the

1383
01:13:55,200 --> 01:13:58,480
thing of the past.
Please make the fact that you

1384
01:13:58,480 --> 01:14:01,400
know there's this alpha male
movement.

1385
01:14:01,440 --> 01:14:04,280
Where you know?
You're allowed to have like

1386
01:14:04,280 --> 01:14:07,120
multiple partners as the man,
but the woman isn't allowed.

1387
01:14:07,120 --> 01:14:09,920
I mean, there are just so many.
Layers just like Nick Cannon or

1388
01:14:09,920 --> 01:14:13,680
whatever the what Nick Cannon?
Oh doesn't he have like 20 some

1389
01:14:13,680 --> 01:14:17,400
babies by different women and
most of them are like monogamous

1390
01:14:17,400 --> 01:14:19,000
with him even though he has
like.

1391
01:14:20,200 --> 01:14:24,480
It's just wild the the like
rules that are applied are just

1392
01:14:24,600 --> 01:14:26,640
insane.
Yeah, it's crazy.

1393
01:14:26,760 --> 01:14:29,360
You know, I also want to mention
just one more thing, and this is

1394
01:14:29,920 --> 01:14:32,680
unfortunately an example of
intersectionality, I think, I

1395
01:14:32,680 --> 01:14:35,640
suppose, where women of color
are more likely to be sexually

1396
01:14:35,640 --> 01:14:37,720
assaulted than white women.
Yeah.

1397
01:14:37,880 --> 01:14:39,520
So we should mention that as
well.

1398
01:14:39,520 --> 01:14:43,840
A. 100% and you know, missing a
murdered indigenous women.

1399
01:14:43,840 --> 01:14:49,360
I mean, that has been for
centuries and is still this the

1400
01:14:49,360 --> 01:14:52,480
same.
And you know, when I, when I

1401
01:14:52,480 --> 01:14:57,080
moved to this land, I remember
hearing a lot of like negative

1402
01:14:57,200 --> 01:15:00,000
talk around reservations and
such.

1403
01:15:00,040 --> 01:15:03,240
And what's interesting, it
wasn't the right kind of

1404
01:15:03,240 --> 01:15:07,440
negative talk.
It was very, believe me, on

1405
01:15:07,480 --> 01:15:11,240
people within reservations when
we know statistically that the

1406
01:15:11,240 --> 01:15:15,800
majority of sexual assaults that
take place on reservations are

1407
01:15:15,800 --> 01:15:19,320
committed by men.
I mean, a lot of them are

1408
01:15:19,800 --> 01:15:23,360
literal man camps, you know,
extractive industries, for

1409
01:15:23,360 --> 01:15:25,600
example.
They'll bring, you know, men on

1410
01:15:25,600 --> 01:15:29,080
mass to live in indigenous
communities.

1411
01:15:29,080 --> 01:15:33,320
And I just finished a class on
this last week so stats are

1412
01:15:33,320 --> 01:15:35,720
fresh in my head.
That is interesting that you

1413
01:15:35,720 --> 01:15:38,960
should say that because at least
in the United States, indigenous

1414
01:15:38,960 --> 01:15:41,880
women are the only group of
women that are far more likely

1415
01:15:41,880 --> 01:15:45,160
to be sexually assaulted by a a
white man, someone outside their

1416
01:15:45,160 --> 01:15:47,680
race.
Right than the stats that we've

1417
01:15:47,840 --> 01:15:51,400
cited here today, right?
Yep, very much worth mentioning

1418
01:15:51,400 --> 01:15:54,960
and also the lack of interest
from law enforcement around

1419
01:15:54,960 --> 01:15:59,040
those women. 0 being murdered or
going missing or being assaulted

1420
01:15:59,040 --> 01:16:00,520
is yeah.
Zero.

1421
01:16:00,760 --> 01:16:03,640
And I'm going to throw one more
grim and disgusting, you know,

1422
01:16:03,640 --> 01:16:08,920
point out there, which is that
people who are developmentally

1423
01:16:08,920 --> 01:16:12,800
delayed, handicapped or have a
psychiatric disorder are much

1424
01:16:12,800 --> 01:16:16,120
more likely to be assaulted than
people who do not.

1425
01:16:16,120 --> 01:16:17,520
OK.
And that's true for men, too.

1426
01:16:17,520 --> 01:16:23,280
But it the stats I I saw was 83%
of developmentally delayed women

1427
01:16:23,280 --> 01:16:27,240
and about 1/3 of developmentally
delayed men have experienced

1428
01:16:27,240 --> 01:16:29,400
that.
And people with severe

1429
01:16:29,400 --> 01:16:31,960
psychiatric problems are twice
as likely as the rest of the

1430
01:16:31,960 --> 01:16:34,560
population to be assaulted,
which is already high.

1431
01:16:35,240 --> 01:16:39,440
A double it for that, Yeah.
So once again, this is this is

1432
01:16:39,440 --> 01:16:41,600
men.
And again, 99% men.

1433
01:16:41,600 --> 01:16:43,680
So don't like both sides.
What about me here?

1434
01:16:43,680 --> 01:16:48,000
Don't come at us.
Yeah, picking on vulnerable

1435
01:16:48,000 --> 01:16:48,680
people.
Yep.

1436
01:16:48,920 --> 01:16:50,320
And I think that that's key,
right?

1437
01:16:50,360 --> 01:16:52,480
Yeah.
You're unconscious, vulnerable.

1438
01:16:52,760 --> 01:16:55,200
You have a severe psychiatric
disorder.

1439
01:16:55,400 --> 01:16:57,560
Vulnerable.
You're developmentally delayed

1440
01:16:57,720 --> 01:17:00,360
vulnerable.
You're a person of color who is

1441
01:17:00,360 --> 01:17:02,680
not going to go to law
enforcement Vulnerable.

1442
01:17:02,680 --> 01:17:04,520
So what's the common denominator
here?

1443
01:17:04,520 --> 01:17:05,200
I.
Think we?

1444
01:17:05,640 --> 01:17:07,360
Yeah.
Yeah, I don't think we need to

1445
01:17:07,560 --> 01:17:11,400
repeat it again.
So my friends, male, female,

1446
01:17:11,400 --> 01:17:13,920
however you're identify This is
why women.

1447
01:17:13,920 --> 01:17:15,240
Choose the bear.
Yep.

1448
01:17:15,960 --> 01:17:19,080
If you were left in any doubt,
let there be doubt no more.

1449
01:17:19,440 --> 01:17:21,600
We don't want it to be this way.
We really don't.

1450
01:17:21,600 --> 01:17:25,000
This is no fuck man.
Like it's We wanted to be

1451
01:17:25,000 --> 01:17:26,840
different.
We would like to go for

1452
01:17:26,840 --> 01:17:30,240
leisurely strolls.
We would like to not, you know,

1453
01:17:30,240 --> 01:17:34,600
carry pepper spray or figure out
inventive ways to put it in your

1454
01:17:34,600 --> 01:17:36,400
luggage when you're traveling so
you haven't.

1455
01:17:36,640 --> 01:17:39,480
Like.
You know, I just like can can we

1456
01:17:39,480 --> 01:17:41,360
not live like that?
We would love to not.

1457
01:17:41,360 --> 01:17:42,880
Live like that, we would love
it.

1458
01:17:43,000 --> 01:17:46,520
We would love to be recording an
episode recap and a reality TV

1459
01:17:46,520 --> 01:17:48,840
show right now.
Agreed, but here we are.

1460
01:17:48,920 --> 01:17:53,920
Yeah, here we are.
So I guess to wrap up our salty

1461
01:17:53,920 --> 01:17:55,280
hoes.
Stay safe out there.

1462
01:17:55,360 --> 01:18:00,640
Yes, salty Bros be better.
Yeah, and I would assume most of

1463
01:18:00,640 --> 01:18:03,720
our salty Bros listening or the
kind of people who would not

1464
01:18:03,720 --> 01:18:06,920
hurt a woman.
Okay, If that's the case, maybe

1465
01:18:06,920 --> 01:18:11,560
think a little harder about sort
of your own attitudes, okay, and

1466
01:18:11,560 --> 01:18:13,920
how you might be contributing to
this.

1467
01:18:13,920 --> 01:18:15,440
So a little self reflection
maybe.

1468
01:18:15,720 --> 01:18:18,120
And if any of this is news to
you, maybe a little a little

1469
01:18:18,120 --> 01:18:20,360
education.
Yeah, we all have blind spots,

1470
01:18:20,360 --> 01:18:22,960
sure, and you know, that's fair
enough.

1471
01:18:23,200 --> 01:18:28,240
But if we are satisfied to live
with them, that's not so fair

1472
01:18:28,240 --> 01:18:30,200
enough.
Yes, that's right.

1473
01:18:30,200 --> 01:18:31,960
We believe, we believe in
progress.

1474
01:18:31,960 --> 01:18:33,400
We don't believe in cancelling
people.

1475
01:18:33,400 --> 01:18:35,320
OK, but no, no better do better,
right?

1476
01:18:35,440 --> 01:18:38,240
Illumination, Yes.
All the good stuff.

1477
01:18:38,680 --> 01:18:41,560
OK.
We need a wee nap after that.

1478
01:18:42,240 --> 01:18:44,800
You know, what I want to do is
like go hang out with some bears

1479
01:18:44,840 --> 01:18:47,160
in in the wild.
I kind of feel like I want to go

1480
01:18:47,160 --> 01:18:50,040
for a hike right now, yeah.
Let's just shake it all off.

1481
01:18:50,240 --> 01:18:52,480
Yeah, right.
I know with the the safe bears,

1482
01:18:52,480 --> 01:18:55,120
there's some complicated bears
indeed.

1483
01:18:55,120 --> 01:18:57,640
At least we have a rhyme to
protect ourselves there.

1484
01:18:57,640 --> 01:19:00,760
It's pretty foolproof.
That's right.

1485
01:19:00,760 --> 01:19:02,160
Thank you for teaching me by the
way.

1486
01:19:03,000 --> 01:19:05,840
You know, I'm always here with
frivolous nature facts.

1487
01:19:06,240 --> 01:19:08,200
I love it.
All right, friends, we're going

1488
01:19:08,200 --> 01:19:10,920
to sign off now.
If you liked this episode, you

1489
01:19:10,920 --> 01:19:12,920
know what to do.
You can give us a five star

1490
01:19:12,920 --> 01:19:14,360
rating.
You can write us a little

1491
01:19:14,360 --> 01:19:15,640
review.
You can follow us.

1492
01:19:15,640 --> 01:19:18,160
That just takes a second, or you
can give us a comment.

1493
01:19:18,160 --> 01:19:21,000
You can also text us or e-mail
us, right, and tell us what you

1494
01:19:21,000 --> 01:19:22,400
think.
What do you want to hear?

1495
01:19:22,400 --> 01:19:24,520
If you have anything you want to
share, please let us know.

1496
01:19:24,520 --> 01:19:27,160
We would be happy to discuss it
on a future episode.

1497
01:19:27,640 --> 01:19:29,520
Absolutely.
We'll see you soon.

1498
01:19:29,800 --> 01:19:30,840
Bye.
Bye.